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Holy Moly!!!! Obama to order salary pay cuts for AIG (And OTHERS!!!)!!!!!!!

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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:43 PM
Original message
Holy Moly!!!! Obama to order salary pay cuts for AIG (And OTHERS!!!)!!!!!!!
Edited on Wed Oct-21-09 02:51 PM by Beetwasher
U.S. to Order Steep Pay Cuts at Firms That Got Most Aid

WASHINGTON — Responding to the growing furor over the paychecks of executives at companies that received billions of dollars in federal bailouts, the Obama administration will order the companies that received the most aid to deeply slash the compensation to their highest paid executives, an official involved in the decision said on Wednesday.

Under the plan, which will be announced in the next few days by the Treasury Department, the seven companies that received the most assistance will have to cut the cash payouts to their 25 best-paid executives by an average of about 90 percent from last year. For many of the executives, the cash they would have received will be replaced by stock that they will be restricted from selling immediately.

--snip--

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/22/business/22pay.html?hp

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2009/10/21/795626/-Obama-to-order-salary-pay-cuts-for-AIG!!!!!!!-(Updated)

Cue the Obama basher/whiners.

"That's not change we can believe in...errr...*gulp*
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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:44 PM
Response to Original message
1. Now they'll whine he's overstepping his authority.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. They have a stink tank for
the latest whining point.
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saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #6
16. There isn't anything but applause for this!
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #16
80. Applause here too....
...from one of the most vocal critics of Obama's centrist policies.
I have consistently argued that Obama has the power to do this and things like this.
.
.
.
NOW, make it so, President Obama.
If not, it is just posturing for the cameras on a popular issue.
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SergeStorms Donating Member (248 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 07:19 AM
Response to Reply #80
130. Yeah, my thoughts as well.......
there seems to be a good deal of talk coming from the White House about how things SHOULD be, but as to the reality of how things will ACTUALLY be............ :shrug:
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Clio the Leo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #16
102. Yay Sara!!!!!
(see, I dont JUST cheer for Obama ;))
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saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:38 AM
Response to Reply #102
120.  Thank you Clio! I never thought you did!
:-)
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sui generis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #1
142. to play devils advocate
IF indeed the top paid "executives" have their pay cut, I don't have a problem with that. Now let's talk about what defines an "executive" - you can be a VP of Bathroom Monitoring at a bank - they pass out titles in lieu of compensation in many cases.

Everybody's a Veep - so if there isn't a lot of "whining" (god damn I hate that word, with pathological focus since it was a republican jibe for the past 8 years), it's because nothing is keeping those "top paid" execs from turning around and telling everyone they need to take deep salary cuts. Keep in mind you can be a veep at a bank and not make more than 60K a year - but the bank bottom line will certainly profit.

No - I don't whine but I'm just wondering where that slippery slope ends if it isn't spelled out clearly, with hard numbers.
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #1
201. It will keep 'em busy while the majoirty of Americans applaud.
The CEOs will still keep their money -- if they work to make their companies profitable for a longer term and get their companies in a position to pay back the taxpayers and turn a profit for shareholders. This is good strategy.

It's like telling your kid he gets the car keys after he shows that he can be responsible for some chores for a while.
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lark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #1
205. That's just petty
most of the complaints on this board about Obama are from him going corporatist and squishy, not for him acting like the person we thought we elected. This is good and I doubt many here will empathize with the robber barons. I am totally thrilled with this action, and expect most here feel exactly the same way.

:bounce:
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Hepburn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:46 PM
Response to Original message
2. Yay!!!!
:applause: :bounce:
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phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
3. No, they will act like their armchair Presidential bitching on the internetz should get the credit.
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polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:49 PM
Response to Original message
4. Good news - too bad Congress didn't take care of this at the time of the bailouts. nt
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Hepburn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:51 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. I totally agree...but I still am loving what I am reading ~~ AIG top Exec's limited to $200K salary.
Sad part is that some of these assholes will feel that with getting that sum they are at the poverty level.
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polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #7
25. You're so right - they'll be whining and crying something fierce! nt
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Grown2Hate Donating Member (833 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #7
140. GOOD! Then they can QUIT (without the "umbrella"), and they can apply
elsewhere, with "AIG Executive" being the #1 item on their resume. Assholes. :)
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waiting for hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
5. Great! About time -
Wall Street needs to be reined in - Now, how about Goldman Sachs?
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saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:54 PM
Response to Reply #5
12. And this needs to apply to ALL the bailout companies, not just the ones that
took the most.
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beac Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #12
104. Agreed. Hope this is only the first of many. n/t
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saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:51 PM
Response to Original message
8. I think this is wonderful news! This is action I can praise President Obama for!
Edited on Wed Oct-21-09 02:52 PM by saracat
Congress however, should have included this in the bailout terms.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:52 PM
Response to Original message
9. Finally - these thugs DESERVED this hammer. Thank you for this sensible course, Pres. Obama.
.
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Occam Bandage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:53 PM
Response to Original message
10. Ultimately meaningless, but a nice gesture. nt
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. Why is it meaningless?
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Occam Bandage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #14
24. Because the problem is not really "these 25 guys made a bit too much money."
The problem is, rather, "a vast proportion of the nation's wealth is directly controlled by an unaccountable, pseudohereditary class of oligarchs."

These guys are to the problem as Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens are to the problem of performance-enhancing drugs in baseball. Yes, they're the highest-profile examples of the problem, yes, they deserve to be punished, and yes, punishing them scarcely counts as a baby step towards fixing the problem.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:08 PM
Response to Reply #24
26. A Step Is A Step And I Would Argue That You Can't Discount The Impact Of The Symoblic Significance
On the culture that's responsible for the outrages.
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Occam Bandage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #26
35. If the end result of this is actual compensation reform, then it will have had significance.
Edited on Wed Oct-21-09 03:17 PM by Occam Bandage
If the end result of this--distinct from the intent, mind you--is to quell populist outrage by making people believe that something has been done, then I fully intend to discount the impact of the symbolic significance.

To be clear, I'm not saying that the White House is approaching this with anything but the purest of motivations and the best of intentions. I just don't think it's that big a deal. And I'm a proud cheerleader.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #35
41. I View This As A First Step
The rest of the reform is coming, I'm pretty confident about that.
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Occam Bandage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #41
42. So long as more steps follow, I'll agree. nt
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BlancheSplanchnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 07:20 AM
Response to Reply #35
131. I think it's highly significant
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 07:21 AM by BlancheSplanchnik
in that this kind of clear message has been lacking for so long.

It's action by leaders that sets the tone for a society...it takes time for the message to permeate, but it will, particularly as the positive results become clear. It can only start with small but public steps.

(for example, I think bushco's creed of uglyness, hypocrisy, false religion, ignorance and greed pervaded the culture quite effectively--we see the result all around us. Similarly, the present vision has only had a short time to gorw, but people are screaming for this kind of compassion and higher values; seeing it displayed by leaders is exactly what's necessary to inspire and guide)


just my $.02
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DireStrike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #35
167. And if the end result is to piss people off
For example, if the right is allowed to capitalize on this through propaganda... then it will have been a bad move.

Repeat it with me: failure should be punished. If they want to make the big decisions and take the big risks, then they get the big punishment.

(like being knocked down to 200k is such a monstrous punishment.)
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lark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #167
206. It would have to be some damn fine propaganda
to get people to actually back paying millions of OUR MONEY, let me repeat - OUR $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ - to the robbers for ruining the world when they should really be in jail. The real issue is, will this get watered down to utter meaninglessness as has every other proposed restriction? I just can't imaging Summers, Geithner and Bernake supporting this and Obama has let them have their way to date. I hope and pray this is real and will not get discarded in the right wing corporatist push back.
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Deep13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #35
188. I have to agree.
Let's see where this goes.
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #26
159. Ah! Finally there's Symbolic Significance we can Believe in!
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #159
160. You Have A Problem With This Move?
Pray tell...
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #160
172. Not particularly yet. But I certainly am not interested in any thing symbolic at this point
... I'll note that as of today this is all still just talk and we have had a lot of that.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #172
176. It's Not Just Symbolic
But even if it WAS, you can't discount that aspect either.
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #176
182. I may be more enthusiastic when we're talking about what he has done ....
.... rather than what he will do. But then again, it depends on what actually gets done.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #182
184. I'm Enthusiastic At Both
Call me an eternal optimist.
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #24
203. It's a warning. If you rich guys come begging to the government for help,
you will have to accept the government, the taxpayers, as stakeholders who have a say in how you run your company and how much you pay your top executives.

Obama is under a lot of international pressure to do this. The French, for example, have been pressing international companies to lower the pay of top executives.

I was thinking this morning: liberty and justice for all. We heard so much about liberty, "freedom," from GWB, but we never heard about justice. It's time to have a little justice. This is just symbolic, but it sends the message: the rich should not be asking the poor for hand-outs. The other way round is OK, but the rich should take care of themselves from a financial point of view.

Now, we need to do something to help keep homeowners in their homes.
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mkultra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 08:34 AM
Response to Reply #14
136. I disagree. This is a correction of a wrong
Even if more steps where not to follow, just letting this go on unabated would be a crime in itself. This is the administration sending a message.
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slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:54 PM
Response to Original message
11. Ok look - people have the right to criticize Obama!
I applaud him for this and am recommending this post - but your "cue the whiners" shit does nothing but divide people and is in no way helpful. I'm overjoyed when Obama does the right thing, but I can also identify with people who feel he had not done enough, not repealed DADT, has us in TWO wars right now, appoints AIG and Goldman Sachs people to high level positions.. I could go on and on but hopefully you get my point.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. Are You Saying That All So Called Criticism Is Valid And Equal???
Do you deny there are knee-jerk Obama bashers here who do nothing BUT find every reason to slam Obama???
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 07:20 AM
Response to Reply #15
132. Has the financial services industry been
regulated? Complaining that long overdue changes in regulation haven't been made is hardly some unjustified knee-jerk reaction. The need for regulatory change should be considered a crisis.

Slam OBama? Hardly. But he does need a swift kick in the ass.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #132
154. Bullshit
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 11:08 AM by Beetwasher
Again, I asked you if you deny that there are kneejerk douchebags who do NOTHING BUT slam Obama on this site. Do you deny that? If you do, what fucking planet do you live on? I'm not condemning valid criticism. However YOUR criticism is NOT valid. It's childish fantasy.

O doesn't need a kick in the ass. You expect him to have done this already??? You're expectations are ludicrous and childish. You can't clean up a mess before you get into a room and see exactly what needs to be cleaned up and that takes a bit of time.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 04:39 PM
Response to Reply #154
234. Characterize it as childish if you wish.
But President Obama has the deregulation advocates Geithner and Summers in his administration. Hell of a way to clean up a mess. So, again, I disagree, Obama needs a kick in the ass and it should have come a long time ago. If not for apologists like you it might have. I'm not a Republican, I don't go happily along in lock step.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qP4d5paLECs
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #234
239. Pathetic
You sit here and whine on DU and then take credit for Obama's accomplishemts. Pathetic.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #239
248. Kind of odd that
you call so many of us whiners. Where do you get off? You are the whiner. You are whining because we expect our elected officials to act in the interest of the American People. So just how many of us did you anger in this thread?
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #248
250. Aww, Poor You, I Angered You??? Wahhhhhh!!!!
Edited on Fri Oct-23-09 11:08 AM by Beetwasher
Did I hurt your feelings? WHINE! :rofl:
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #250
252. You aren't even a real Democrat.
You're only here to to create problems. I suspect you are a stealth Republican.
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lark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 02:27 PM
Response to Reply #15
207. Can I play?
I deny it.

Now, I'm not here every day and don't read every thread, but based on what I've seen, the complaints are valid. I've seen much more, oh don't worry, he'll fix it later, or he must have been mislead, or it doesn't really matter if we have the public option, etc. People selling out their beliefs for the charisma nad promise of Obama is more the norm than bashing for no reason.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #207
211. Then You're Willfully Ignorant, Blind or Lying
Because there damn sure are posters who have nothing constructive except slams.
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:57 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. there are as many or more threads that say "cue the cheerleaders" FWIW
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phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:01 PM
Response to Reply #11
21. The "cue the whiners" shit is VALID because the whiners have no adult sense of patience or realism.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:05 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. Those Of Us Who Are Labelled So Called "Cheerleaders" Knew This Sort Of Stuff Was Coming
We've counselled patience and argued this sort of change doesn't happen overnight. So it's sweet to see our patience rewarded.
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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. No you didn't
Edited on Wed Oct-21-09 03:09 PM by jgraz
And we don't know it's coming now. Just like Obama's call to pay back last year's bonuses, this may die a quiet death.

On the other hand, if Obama makes it stick, I'll be breaking out my pompons.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #28
32. Yes I Did
Edited on Wed Oct-21-09 03:10 PM by Beetwasher
Just as I know it's going to happen.

Heh, right on cue.
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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:12 PM
Response to Reply #32
37. Prove it.
Point to one post of yours predicting that Obama will demand paycuts for executives at bailed out companies.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:18 PM
Response to Reply #37
43. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #21
38. Handy translation for those of us on the left
"adult" = corporatist
"patience" = corporatism
"realism" = corporatism
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phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #38
46. Its not my fault that your insatiable desire for instant gratification causes you unneeded anger.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:30 PM
Response to Reply #46
91. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #91
96. Geez, if you keep allowing your nerves to be struck, you are gonna have a breakdown.
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Divine Discontent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #91
105. I'm sure they'll ignore the part in the story also that says they get stock options to make up for
the cut in pay, that they just have to wait to cash in!


S
O
S
D
D
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:26 AM
Response to Reply #105
161. I think that's an improvement - isn't it?
You get deferred compensation that requires you to think several years down the road about your company's welfare rather than play tricks to get a quarter's worth of unsustainable growth.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #161
166. Of Course It Is, But Some People Just HAVE To Find SOMETHING To Whine About
n/t
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 01:51 PM
Response to Reply #105
204. That's OK. The problem is that, as so many have said, they want to
take their gains in pay and bonuses and pass their losses on to the taxpayers. That is what is wrong.

I believe there is a bill requiring companies to obtain shareholder approval of salary schedules for the big guys in the companies.
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mkultra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 08:40 AM
Response to Reply #38
139. dont forget these
Obama smears = constructive criticism
Obama support = blind cheerleading.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #139
148. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #11
68. the point is, the whiners have been complaining he's been letting
these companies suck us dry - and now they will whine that he is interfering with private industry and going all socialistic.

there is a 'damned if you do, damned if you don't' contingent here, and that is who is being addressed.
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girl gone mad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #68
89. I seriously doubt anyone on DU would make that argument..
at least not the people who have opposed the massively corrupt bailouts.
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Lilith Velkor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 01:38 AM
Response to Reply #89
123. Remember all those OPs saying that leftists and teabaggers are exactly alike?
They're not kidding. They actually believe that. Seriously.

Cognitive dissonance is a helluva drug.
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spoony Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #68
100. And until now that's been true.
Now he's doing something about it. You're not going to find anyone here complaining about him being a "socialist."
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Clio the Leo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #100
103. Perhaps the ONE thing we might all agree on....
.... is that he's not socialistic ENOUGH! lol

I dont want a bailout, I want a government run commune! :)
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mkultra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 08:35 AM
Response to Reply #11
137. so you can criticise Obama but we cant criticise you?
whats good for the goose is good for the gander. Criticizing Obama is pretty damn divisive all on its own.
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lark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #137
208. So Dems are supposed to just cheer him - no matter what?
We're supposed to cheer - escalation in Afghanistan, keeping extraordinary rendition in place, keeping secret wiretaps in place, bailing out wall st. but cutting most of the bail out for main st., no changes to DADT, no changes to DOMA? All of those are Bush area programs that he is standing up for. Criticizing these is divisive? Then why the hell did we elect him if we cheer him for the immoral Bush programs that he's continuing? We cheer him when he does something progressive and fuss when he's a corporatist. That is right and proper, in my book.
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mkultra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #208
235. If you can make logical jumps then so can I. Welcome to DU.
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 05:15 PM by mkultra
So are we suppose to never express any opinions that may be positive. So are we suppose to the place the blame for all things on Obama? Are we supposed to expect everything be magically done. Do we expect that he wipe his but with the constitution like Bush did but just for our goals instead of GOP goals?


You can jam the stick as far to one side as you want it doesn't change the truth of the dynamic which is that the serial whiners are never happy and cant stand to be criticized. A Vast majority stood against Obama in the primary and still hate him even to this day. Their perspective is myopic about pace and scale and the duties of a sitting president in a democracy.

Why did we elect him? The answer is simple. They didn't while i did. If they had voted for him, they would know what to expect from him and wouldn't be upset when he does it exactly how he said he would. Most of us know that the people who complain constantly all SAY they voted for him but we can easily scan historical posts and see that they swore they wouldn't.
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:55 PM
Response to Original message
13. I just heard Freeper Heads Explode
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quantass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
18. America only gets change after a travesty...and so finally...Welcome back Change! nt
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Hepburn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
19. It's not only AIG ~~ he is also nailing these companies as well:
The companies affected are: Bank of America, Citigroup, General Motors, Chrysler, GMAC and Chrysler Financial.

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory?id=8882622#

I would like to call out a big FUCK YOU to Bank of America!
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Yup!
n/t
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
22. Ah, new material for Glenn Beck
Obama is headed closer to becoming a DICTATOR!!! It would be a good time for some crocodile tears as he fears what is happening to his country.
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CountAllVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:08 PM
Response to Original message
27. GM, Citi, Chrysler, AIG and Bank Of America.
Breaking news right now on Msnbc - Obama admin will order steep pay cuts on the top 7 bailed out firms. Some of those firms are:

GM, Citi, Chrysler, AIG and Bank Of America.

*********
Cry babies cry!!! :cry:

Just fucking breaks my heart!!!! :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity:

:kick: and recommend.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #27
30. They Have No One To Blame But Themselves
n/t
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CountAllVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #30
34. they took that money
and they never bothered to pay it back or pass it on to investors.

FUCK THEM.

:nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity:
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #27
163. How does that work though? How can he simply order pay cuts?
As much as I want that to happen I don't understand the mechanism.
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intheflow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:44 AM
Response to Reply #163
170. I'm guessing a retroactive clause in the terms of their bailout agreement.
I mean, it's not like the bankers aren't changing the terms of millions of contracts they have with credit card holders or other borrowers without notice, and those run-of-the-mill people didn't just get a huge chunk of federal tax dollars. I'm hoping there's legal precident to this move, anyway.
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #170
173. That doesn't seem the least bit legal, unless ....
... there was some clause allowing the government to change the terms at any time - much like all credit card agreements have. That would be sweet poetic justice. But I'd be surprised if these companies would have gone into such an agreement.
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Thrill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:09 PM
Response to Original message
29. And what do you know. Go check the DOW now
They're pissed
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CountAllVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. . . .
:nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity::nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity: :nopity:
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phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #29
48. Nah, thats been the trend on and off for a few weeks.
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Thrill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:49 PM
Response to Reply #48
74. Nope. It was up 39. And when this flashed across. It tanked
Despite good earnings news
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phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:09 PM
Response to Reply #74
88. Um, YEP, look at the trends over the past week. And NO analysts are saying this has anything to do..
with it. Pay attention to whats actually going on before rushing to judgements.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Wall-St-loses-ground-Boeing-rb-3302651387.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=main&asset=&ccode=

"U.S. stocks ended lower on Wednesday, hurt by a late-day sell-off in financial shares after an influential analyst recommended selling Wells Fargo ."

The stock shift today have NOTHING, ZERO, NOT A DAMN THING to do with this news.
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Oregone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:10 PM
Response to Original message
33. "Cue the Obama basher/whiners"
Stupid way to start a thread. Most people are going to agree this is a good step. Im not sure why you want to twist everything into a fight or an insult at people on the left.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #33
36. Whatever
Feel free to unrec.

I'm not insulting "people on the left". I'm insulting whiners.
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Oregone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #36
40. Ah, it just seems you label people on the left as "whiners"
Same thing.

The bottom line is you posted a news story and attached snide comments that cause further division. Im not sure what your intention was, but thats the effect. Seems pointless to pre-empt "whining" with childish divisive and behavior.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. No, Just The Whiners
Considering I'm about as left as it gets. I'm just a realist who knows shit is not accomplished immediately just because I want it to be.
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slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #40
53. I tried to point that out but the original poster just wants to fight with people it seems
:shrug:
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #40
155. +1
"Seems pointless to pre-empt "whining" with childish divisive and behavior."


---------------


some people get off on playing the victim
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spoony Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:03 PM
Response to Reply #33
98. Indeed, just more divisive stupidity. nt
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Divine Discontent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #98
111. ignore is my new friend with these types of hostile screamers, reading his commentary
with others looks like an AOL comment section. Painful.

Hope you're well, spoony!
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Divine Discontent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #33
109. because they wanna argue. simple enough.
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:14 PM
Response to Original message
39. the stuff about the whiners is so STUPID
we're all on the same side.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #39
45. Uhh, No, We're Not
Most of us are, but there are plenty of posters here who are most certainly not on our side.
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Oregone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #45
47. Please let "us" know when "we" win the fight against "them" on DU
The whining green martian moon men must be stopped
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #47
50. Uhh, Ok Chester
Whatever you say. Have fun in your little fantasy world. I'll live in reality, thanks!
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #45
56. You got THAT right!! EV-ER-Y time they doubt, scorn and
discredit him, he comes outta know where with TA-DA!!! How you like me now!:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #45
66. no, your loyalty test is garbage
no one at DU authorized your loyalty test. It has no validity.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #66
67. That's The Stupidest Fucking Think I've Ever Heard
I'm just pointing out an obvious fact. You think there are no trolls/disruptors/whatever on this board? What fucking planet do you live on?
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #67
71. You don't get to decide who's "loyal" to Obama
we're all democrats here. If you see a troll, hit alert, the mods will take care of them. If the mods let them stay then they are every bit as good a DUer as you are.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:49 PM
Original message
Sure I Do
Edited on Wed Oct-21-09 03:55 PM by Beetwasher
I get to decide all the time who I think is a troll or not. Just like I get to decide who I think is a whining douchebag. What fucking planet do you live on?

And this has nothing to do w/ "loyalty", it has to do w/ reality and pragmatism. IOW, there are those of us who realize that O wants to change things, but it takes time. And then there are the whining bashers, douchebags and trolls who do nothing but constantly complain.
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:42 PM
Response to Original message
93. SLAM DUNK! n/t
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #39
65. No, "whiners" is actually quite appropriate after 9 months
of this shit.

Some of us are just suppose to roll over and pretend we don't notice all the whining? Don't think so.

And, the whiners know who they are.
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slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:27 PM
Response to Original message
49. Cue the Obama cheerleaders!
two can play at this stupid game.. :crazy: :silly: :boring:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #49
51. Yes, Cue Them!
Edited on Wed Oct-21-09 03:28 PM by Beetwasher
:woohoo:

Sucks for you. Nothing to whine about, huh? Oh, that's right, now you can whine that I'm being mean to the whiners. :rofl:
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slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #51
54. I am sorry I recommended this thread at all
you are a very mean spirited person
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #54
59. Sucks For You!
Welcome to the internets.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #59
63. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. LOL!
Edited on Wed Oct-21-09 03:34 PM by Beetwasher
"Bite me alien boy."

Yes, run away! Run away!

Another one bites the dust.
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lark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #64
209. Methinks your tag line says it all
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #209
212. Nope, I Got A Lot More Than That To Say
You got a problem w/ that, Chester?
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #209
236. +1 nt
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phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #49
52. Yes, cue us reveling in the fact that we have been and continue to be right all along.
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slay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #52
57. Yes, cause you are all knowing and never wrong
:crazy:
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phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #57
69. And now I'm reveling in your bitterness over my being right.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #49
55. You offer nothing..no, wait..
less than nothing.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #55
60. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #60
62. "you are a very mean spirited person"
tsk tsk. :rofl:
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #62
94. It musta been something to get it removed..
glad I didn't bother to go back.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:58 PM
Response to Reply #94
95. Pretty Lame Actually
Edited on Wed Oct-21-09 04:58 PM by Beetwasher
Just told you to fuck off if memory serves. :hi:

Vindication is sweet, huh?
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #95
101. The
Sweetest!:hi:
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NYC_SKP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #49
255. Here!!!
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kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
58. Howdya like THEM apples, Obama bashers??
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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:32 PM
Response to Original message
61. Notice all the complaints about post #1.
When those people read "obama bashers/whiners" those people took that personally.
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phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #61
70. Good observation. And normally when someone takes it personal, its because its true.
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:49 PM
Response to Reply #70
73. no, it might be slander
people that get slandered tend to get really pissed off.
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phleshdef Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #73
97. LOL... slander, such overdramatic BS, I love it.
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HopeOverFear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:29 PM
Response to Reply #70
90. Exactly.
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high density Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:48 PM
Response to Original message
72. Thanks for reminding me of "Green Screen McCain"
LOL

If people at AIG can't live with $200k a year and a $25k expense account then maybe they should run their businesses better and not attempt to crater the world economy with their amazingly inept lose-lose decisions.
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saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:50 PM
Response to Original message
75. I appreciate this gesture and congratulate Obama for it but you ruin
this thread with all the nastiness you and others post about other DUers with diverse opinions regarding aspects of the Admin. You are 'creating division" where there isn't any. So far there has been NO criticism of the president for this action and yet, you behave as though there is an attack on him for it! I will give a big Thank You to the President for this one but no thanks to you are the other nasty folks in this thread.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #75
76. Whatever, Glad You Appreciate This Act
I'm an asshole. I'll revel in being right about my judgement of Obama and rub it in the faces of the whining douchebags and trolls if I feel like it. Welcome to the internets.
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #75
77. +1
cheers to Obama, jeers to the people creating fake divisions.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #77
78. Heh, The Division Is Not Fake
Do you deny there are whining douchebags and trolls who frequent this site who never have a good thing to say about O? What planet do you live on?
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Enrique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #78
79. Cheers to Obama
this isn't the first thing that he's done that I've liked. I'll keep giving him props when he does something good, and keep criticizing him when he does something bad.

:bounce:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:56 PM
Response to Reply #79
81. Good for you!
n/t
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #75
122. -2
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ampad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #75
141. You got some fucking nerve
You probably got me on ignore by now but oh well. You have some nerve trying to point fingers at others for being divisive. Your behavior during the primaries tells anyone what they need to know about your concern for politeness. Also, you are one of the ones that will show your ass over in GD. Calling folks cheerleaders and Obama defenders as if the poster does not have a screen name to be called by. No to you their screen names are "Obama defenders" . You do this before the so called "Obama defender" even steps foot in the thread. Calling people who have the nerve to use the unrec function obama defenders are daring them to use it in order to create a scene. I notice you do this when you got a bunch of your buddies over there to give you a little e-courage. You got some nerve pointing fingers at others. What a bunch of bull.
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ipaint Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
82. Good for Obama and thank god for whiners.
If it wasn't for folks raising their voices in outrage this wouldn't happen.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:00 PM
Response to Reply #82
83. LOL!!!
Riiiiiighhhttt!!
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lark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #82
210. Luv ya
:hug:
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GCP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:01 PM
Response to Original message
84. Woot
Edited on Wed Oct-21-09 04:01 PM by GCP
:woohoo:
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
85. Now maybe they'll get rid of their "best" execs and get some real execs in there! nt
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GCP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
86. Do they still get bonuses?
It may be meaningless to cut their salaries, if they still get obscene bonuses.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:05 PM
Response to Reply #86
87. Read The Article
n/t
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Divine Discontent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:37 PM
Response to Reply #87
106. snark!
they still get their salaries, just in the form of stock options they have to wait to cash in, apparently.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #106
110. That's Way different than cash
And there will be restrictions even on that.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #110
147. It's still valuable consideration for work done, which makes it compensation...
:hi:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #147
149. Not Necessarily Valuable
That depends. How would you like to have been paid in GM stock that you couldn't sell any time you wanted?
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #149
152. The mere potential for value is itself valuable. That's what an "option" is...
and an "option" is something that, contractually speaking, may only be traded for valuable consideration.

This is definitional. :hi:

"How would you like to have been paid in GM stock that you couldn't sell any time you wanted?"

Versus nothing? Gimme gimme gimme!
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 10:42 AM
Response to Reply #152
153. No, Not Versus Nothing, Versus A Guaranteed Salary
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 10:43 AM by Beetwasher
And a golden parachute that gets paid regardless of performance. That is what we are talking about. I have no problems w/ these stock options. It means they are much more invested in making the company successful and profitable and that's good for the employees who make much less than them.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #153
156. Which is why the story in the OP is a bit misleading, eh?
The story in the OP makes it sound like this is a straight pay cut. But it's really just a change from cash compensation to stock options. Not earth-shattering in the least.

"And a golden parachute that gets paid regardless of performance."

The article makes it clear that this will not affect pensions, so the "golden parachute" will still be paid, regardless of performance.

"I have no problems w/ these stock options."

I have a problem with the way this story has been reported. To not mention that the "90% pay cut (sic)" simply means that the 90% has been converted to stock options instead of cash is deceptive, at best.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #156
158. Golden Parachute Is Not A Pension
I don't know if the story is misleading or not. It may just be the details need to be more fully filled in. I'll wait to see the full details, but this is VERY encouraging regardless.

You can bet your ass the CEO's will be mega pissed off. This is NOT good for them, regardless.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #158
162. I'm not sure what you think a "golden parachute" is...
"A golden parachute is an agreement between a company and an employee (usually upper executive) specifying that the employee will receive certain significant benefits if employment is terminated.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_parachute"

Pensions surely qualify under this definition, though severance packages would as well.

At any rate, this is all a distraction. The Master is not ordering a pay cut--he is ordering that cash compensation be converted into stock options.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #162
164. Wrong
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 11:35 AM by Beetwasher
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/

"In the AIG trading division, the arm of the company whose risky trades caused its downfall, no top executive will receive more than $200,000 in total compensation,.."

That's a pay cut. Period. Total compensation is total compensation.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #164
171. AIG is being treated differently, BUT they will still get their "bonuses"...
The article does mention that AIG will be treated differently than the rest, but AIG is about to hand out the SECOND round of taxpayer funded "bonuses" since Obama took office.

Your link is bad, but if it's a repost of the NYTimes story, I noticed you snip snipped before the inconvenient part:


"At the financial products division of A.I.G., the locus of problems that plagued the insurer and forced its rescue with more than $180 billion in taxpayer assistance, no top executive will receive more than $200,000 in total compensation, and officials in that unit will not receive any other compensation, like stocks or stock options. Some bonuses previously promised will be paid in the coming year, and it is not clear how much of those will be awarded."

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/22/business/22pay.html?_r=1&_...
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #171
175. Umm, What You Posted Confirms What I Said
"...and officials in that unit will not receive any other compensation, like stocks or stock options. Some bonuses previously promised will be paid in the coming year, and it is not clear how much of those will be awarded."

Some bonuses previously promised will be paid, maybe. We don't have the details.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #175
179. And what I said (which is the point of quotes): "Some bonuses previously promised will be paid..."
:hi:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #179
180. and it is not clear how much of those will be awarded."
Forgot that part. :hi:

So MAYBE some bonuses will be paid and some won't.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #180
181. Since ALL of them were "awarded" (funny word) at 100% last time, and no new regulation is proposed
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 12:12 PM by Romulox
as to the payment of said bonuses (wouldn't the announcement regarding pay cuts been a convenient time to announce any new restrictions on so-called "bonuses"?) the logical inference is that they will ALL be paid out at 100% once more. :hi:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #181
183. Except It Doesn't Say That Now Does It?
Nope, sure doesn't. Infer all you want.

This is a good move and good news. Feel free to bitch that it's not perfect though! :hi:
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #183
189. Your agenda becomes clearer. nt
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #189
190. What? You're Busted Just Making Shit Up So Now I Have An Agenda?
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 12:32 PM by Beetwasher
:rofl:

Oh, I have an agenda all right. Exposing your bullshit. Mission accomplished.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #190
192. LOL. Remembering what happened 6 months ago isn't "making shit up".
Perhaps you just became interested in this issue? :shrug:

They paid out the AIG bonuses at 100% last time, didn't mention any plans to do otherwise this time. :hi:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #192
193. No, Making Shit Up Has To Do W/ Your "Inferring" Shit That Isn't Being Reported
That's called "Making shit up".
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:11 PM
Response to Reply #193
214. In other words, remembering the last round of AIG bonuses.
:silly:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #214
216. No, Making Shit Up That Wasn't In The Story Through "Inference"
IOW, just making shit up.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:18 PM
Response to Reply #216
217. You can demand people read news story with feigned ignorance of the context if you like
But it makes you look foolish.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #217
218. I Demand Nothing But Call Your Bullshit Bullshit
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 03:21 PM by Beetwasher
Make up shit all you want, but I'll call you on it all I want.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #218
222. Nothing is being made up. AIG bonuses paid for with taxpayer money are very real.
And have been reported in every major news organ. I am simply commenting that the government is saying that more taxpayer funded bonuses will be paid. Presumably, under the same conditions as last time, since no new restrictions have been announced or proposed by the Obama admin in the interim.

At any rate, enough with the temper tantrum. :hi:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #222
224. Yes, You Are Making Shit Up That's Not In The Story
Point out where it says all bonuses will be paid in full. I'll wait.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #224
226. I'm discussing a news story and making logical inferences based on context.
That this is so threatening to you suggests you don't understand how internet discussion boards work. :silly:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #226
228. And Your Inferences Are Bullshit
I'm calling you on it. Welcome to the internets.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:34 PM
Response to Reply #228
232. For the *logically coherent* and *in no way overly emotional and hostile* reasons you put forth...
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 03:35 PM by Romulox
er, right?

I'm not sure why I'm having such a hard time saying goodbye to you, but I am... :cry:

Thanks for the laugh. Seriesly.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #232
233. Parting Is Such Sweet Sorrow
I will miss your blathering idiocy and dishonest bullshit. Oh well.

*smooch* Thanks for the laugh, cupcake.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #162
191. Also, Just For The Record, Pensions Are For Retirement
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 12:36 PM by Beetwasher
Golden parachutes and severence pay have nothing to do w/ pensions and retirement.

Get your facts straight. Your wiki link does nothing to support your idiotic claim that a golden parachute is a pension plan despite your warped attempt at redefinition. It has to do w/ termination and has absolutely nothing to do w/ a pension. At all.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #191
194. This is your own definition. Excessive pensions are indeed compensation regardless of performance
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 12:39 PM by Romulox
issued upon termination of employment. They're golden parachutes, by the definition above.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:39 PM
Response to Reply #194
196. Uhh, No, Termination Is Not Retirement
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 12:41 PM by Beetwasher
It's termination. Duh.

Umm, what's my definition? That a pension is for retirement? On what fucking planet do you live on where it's not defined as such?
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #196
198. Retirement is indeed the termination of employment. No barrister, you. nt
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:42 PM
Response to Reply #198
200. LOL! Oh Brother, Way To Make Yourself Look Stupid
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 12:42 PM by Beetwasher
So is ALL termination retirement, Chester? :eyes:

So when you get fired from your job at McDonalds at 17 years old for starting a grease fire in your hair, you get your pension pay out?
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:09 PM
Response to Reply #200
213. No logician, either.
"So is ALL termination retirement, Chester?"

Superman is a man. I am a man. Ergo I am Superman. Your logic is flawless.

Retirement is a type of (typically voluntary) termination of employment. You're thinking of "involuntary termination". And just so you don't get confused--"involuntary termination" is a type of termination, but not all terminations are involuntary! :hi:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #213
215. Umm, Einstein, That's YOUR LOGIC! ROFL
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 03:23 PM by Beetwasher
I asked you a question, Jeenyus, why don't you answer it? I wasn't making a logical statement.

You say retirement IS termination, therefore a golden parachute is Pension because it's paid upon TERMINATION.

That's YOUR idiotic logic. I was ridiculing you and deservedly so.

Pensions are payable only upon retirement. Period. Golden parachutes and severence ARE NOT PENSIONS in any way shape or form.

You knew that but your just being purposefuly obtuse.

At this point your intellectual dishonesty deserves only ridicule. So, keep it up and I will continue to ridicule your dishonest idiocy.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:23 PM
Response to Reply #215
219. Ummm, you're still not getting the "Superman is a Man. I am a man" example
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 03:25 PM by Romulox
I think you're just having a fit now. Words can mean whatever you like (in your own head), but my experience is that "characterization" arguments are the least productive.

If you would like to believe that retirement does not entail the termination of employment (and that, even if we accept this strange premise, this somehow excuses $50 million dollar pension plans for bailed out Wall Street execs,) then that's your right.

I will continue to point out that the inaccuracies in stories like the OP. As is my right. :hi:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #219
221. Good Grief You Are Looking Painfully Stoopid
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 03:28 PM by Beetwasher
Keep it up jeenyus!
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #221
223. You do you realize that stomping of feat/calling of names isn't convincing, right?
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 03:28 PM by Romulox
:silly:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:29 PM
Response to Reply #223
225. Neither Is Blathering Idiocy, But It Doesn't Stop You From Continuing To Post
n/t
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #225
227. This is now just basic trolling. nt
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #227
229. No, It's Ridicule For Someone Who Deserves It For Supreme Dishonesty
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 03:33 PM by Beetwasher
No go and alert me and run away, boy.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #229
230. "Supreme Dishonesty" (capitalized and everything!)? Lololol. Enough with you. nt
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:34 PM
Response to Reply #230
231. Yes, Run Away! Run Away!
:rofl:

Buh bye, Cupcake.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #191
195. PS: Rah rah rah. We get it. nt
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #195
197. PS: WHINE!
Thanks for making my point.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #86
145. Yes. The article states they will still get their bonuses AND pensions.
This is a shell game, in other words.
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Engineer4Obama Donating Member (610 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 04:41 PM
Response to Original message
92. Yeah Green Screen Mcain he's my favorite!
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spoony Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:05 PM
Response to Original message
99. Good move.
Definitely a positive step so kudos to Obama.

But none to you, OP, for trying to further divide and label DUers.
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Divine Discontent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #99
107. amen. I read that "cue" line & thought, well, that's immature to post
some just have no tact, and wouldn't know what it means to reserve their whine until someone actually says "big deal" about the story.

And ultimately, though this is a good thing indeed, it says they get what they're losing in cash salary in the form of stock options that they must wait to cash in.
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jimlup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:40 PM
Response to Original message
108. I think this plays well on Mainstreet
I for one am absolutely pissed off to the point of absolute disgust towards these financial vampire CEO's. It is time to trim their salaries - hell it may be time to TAR and FEATHER them.

No matter what the right wing anti-Obama machine says this plays in Obama's favor with the voters.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:47 PM
Response to Original message
112. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:50 PM
Response to Reply #112
113. Live One Here
Have at it peeps! It's begging for a bruising.
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druidity33 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 06:01 PM
Response to Reply #113
115. already gone! nt.
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SpartanDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 05:54 PM
Response to Original message
114. Let Obama's work speak for itself
no need to taunt
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 06:03 PM
Response to Reply #114
116. Maybe No "Need"
But it sure is fun. Sue me.
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JNelson6563 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 06:17 PM
Response to Original message
117. Bravo Mr. President!
Thanks for the update Beetwasher. :hi:

Julie
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donheld Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 09:45 PM
Response to Original message
118. Great job
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Lilith Velkor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-21-09 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
119. Awesome!
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:43 AM
Response to Original message
121. More taxpayer $$$ for bonuses, plus stock options instead of cash. BFD.
The plan will also change the form of the pay to align the personal interests of the executives with the longer-term financial health of the companies. For instance, the cash portion of the executives’ salaries will be slashed on average by 90 percent, and the rest will be replaced by stock that cannot be sold for years.

But while the plan would pare compensation substantially from what the highest-paid people at the companies might have received under normal circumstances, it would still permit multimillion-dollar pay packages.


-snip-

Some bonuses previously promised will be paid in the coming year, and it is not clear how much of those will be awarded.

(emphasis mine, to cut through all the misdirection)

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/22/business/22pay.html?_r=1&hp
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 04:52 AM
Response to Reply #121
126. Stocks drop, when they do people have been known to suffer.
I say put them in stock---there's no gurantee they'll do well.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 09:48 AM
Response to Reply #126
144. OK, but this isn't really a pay cut at all. He's forcing to accept stock instead of cash.
And the misdirection: the Obama admin is going to go to bat again to defend the second round of taxpayer funded bonuses in his 9 month administration. :hi:
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #121
168. This is how the exec's interests are put in line with the long term good of the company ...
... it's a good thing isn't it?
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #168
185. What's it's NOT is a 90% pay cut.
:hi:
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #185
186. Right. The 90% only applies to salary - often the smaller part of exec compensation
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #186
187. The NYTimes story reports that foregone salary will still be paid-- just as stock options.
Which is not to disagree with your point.


"The plan will also change the form of the pay to align the personal interests of the executives with the longer-term financial health of the companies. For instance, the cash portion of the executives’ salaries will be slashed on average by 90 percent, and the rest will be replaced by stock that cannot be sold for years. "
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 02:55 AM
Response to Original message
124. Excellent! Hope he doesn't back down n/t
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #124
169. That's the question. We're celebrating before a single thing has been done ....
.... not a single executive has actually had their pay altered by this statement yet.

There's lots of time for this plan to be softened while the media is occupied with other things.
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jeanpalmer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 04:16 AM
Response to Original message
125. While the banks are stealing billions from us
This really is insignificant. It amounts to nothing.
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Anakin Skywalker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 05:13 AM
Response to Original message
127. ABOUT DAMN TIME! A$$hole Execs Make Way Too Much
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 05:13 AM by Anakin Skywalker
already. Most of them are FAILURES and that's why we are in this mess. These $cumbags don't need anymore $100,000+ cars or McMansions.
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BlancheSplanchnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 07:12 AM
Response to Original message
128. YEAHHHH!!!
GOBama!

I knew he'd come up with some way to face the obscene greed-- he wasn't just talking. He just can't do everything instantaneously.
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Enthusiast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 07:13 AM
Response to Original message
129. I would rather have REAL
and strict regulations placed on the financial services industry. No, fuck that, how about we just restore Glass-Steagal and break up these 'too big to fail' corporations.

I fear this measure by the Obama Administration is just so we take our eyes off the real ball, the ball of REAL regulatory change with TEETH and an enforcement mechanism. I will believe it when I see it.
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Kermitt Gribble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 08:16 AM
Response to Original message
133. I rec'd your post
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 08:18 AM by Kermitt Gribble
despite your last couple of imbecilic lines:

"Cue the Obama basher/whiners.

"That's not change we can believe in...errr...*gulp*".

You're post is good news, don't be a moran.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #133
151. Tough Shit
I'll post whatever the fuck I want.

Thanks for the rec, Chester!
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scentopine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 08:26 AM
Response to Original message
134. LOL! A grand total of 25 people...
If we can order their pay to be cut, we can order their pay to be cut to zero by firing the sons of bitches and taking over their company. They failed in their job and this failure led to a worldwide disaster. They should be removed and aggressively investigated for crimes. This would be reason to celebrate.
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LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 08:33 AM
Response to Original message
135. Remember this program developed under the Bush admin - we gave them a year
Now Obama is in charge - don't fuck with him!
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info being Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 08:37 AM
Response to Original message
138. I still see a few too many "wills" in there to celebrate anything
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quantass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 09:12 AM
Response to Original message
143. Good News Yes...(BUT)...I'm still very skeptical over O's Financial Regulation abilities / foresight
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 09:17 AM by quantass
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Jakes Progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 09:49 AM
Response to Original message
146. Nice move. nt
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
150. Excellent. Recommended.
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:21 AM
Response to Original message
157. Holy executive pay cuts Batman!
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DireStrike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:35 AM
Response to Original message
165. :O
Wow. Wow wow wow. I will be shocked if it goes through, but WOW.


WOW!!! <--justified use of 3 exclamation points

(These are good wows.)
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GOTV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
174. Shouldn't you be thanking the whiners for pushing Obama towards moves like these?
He wouldn't be doing this if the only thing he heard was cheering since his election.
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #174
178. No
"He wouldn't be doing this if the only thing he heard was cheering since his election."

Says you.
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bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
177. good, make them work for their money, we have.
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ehrnst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
199.  Cue the Glenn Becks and others to defend these poor defenseless millionares...(nt)
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Stumbler Donating Member (599 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 01:43 PM
Response to Original message
202. Avoid trying to cap compensation, it's a losing strategy
For real reform, repeal the Reagan tax-cuts. That'll effect everyone who's caused these problems, without giving ammo to the RW nuts who'll claim Obama's government is taking over the private sector. Besides, we already know they're bitching about high taxes already, so let's give 'em something real to bitch about.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-22-09 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
220. CHEERS FOR OBAMA ... What can we all do to help him?
Edited on Thu Oct-22-09 03:25 PM by defendandprotect
Presume keep writing and calling -- I will also be trying to support Dems -- like
Franken with contributions -- and others who aren't Blue Dogs or DLC--!!!

Basically, we need to immediately re-regulate capitalism . . . unless we want to have
them have the ability to pull us down into a hole like this AGAIN!!

Re-regulate them out of business --

This is treachery, treason they've pulled -- the corporate-military also needs to be
severely reigned in -- but they're one and all bankrupting the Treasury and running off
with the loot!

Leaving behind only human destruction!!!
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 12:17 AM
Response to Original message
237. "New rules cost GM's Henderson cash but may hike his pay"
Henderson’s total compensation package will increase to about $5.5 million under terms of the pay plan, a person familiar with the documents said.

Henderson’s cash salary, which was $1.26 million, is being decreased by 25% to $950,000. He will receive stock and restricted stock in GM valued at about $4.2 million.

http://freep.com/article/20091022/BUSINESS01/91022070/1319/New-rules-cost-GM-s-Henderson-cash-but-may-hike-his-pay


Awesome! :eyes:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 09:14 AM
Original message
Bullshit
“He’s getting less cash and the other stuff that he’s getting may or may not pay out, and if it does pay out, it will pay out over a period of years,” she said.


May or may not. Guess you don't read so well. What a surprise.

Yeah, stock options can go up, IF you MAKE THE COMPANY SUCCESSFUL. I have no problems w/ paying w/ stock options. It makes you more invested and responsible for the success and health of the company.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 10:24 AM
Response to Original message
240. LOL. Now you want the Detroit Free Press silenced?
Edited on Fri Oct-23-09 10:26 AM by Romulox
The only part of that post that wasn't a verbatim quote was "Awesome! :eyes: "
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 10:28 AM
Response to Reply #240
241. Umm, Who Said Anything About Silencing Anyone, Chester??? What Dishonest Fucking Bullshit
Edited on Fri Oct-23-09 10:29 AM by Beetwasher
Why do you lie so much? I mean yes, you're full of shit, but at least try to be more subtle about it.

You didn't post the key part that said "may or may not". Wonder why that is. Oh, it's because you're dishonest and would like to spin this to support your whining when it doesn't.
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #241
242. It's a verbatim quote from the Fee Press. No more clown dancing with you. nt
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 10:32 AM
Response to Reply #242
244. So You Admit You're A C lown? Ok Then!
Edited on Fri Oct-23-09 10:33 AM by Beetwasher
I thought context was important to you:

Julie Gibson, a GM spokeswoman, cautioned against looking at Henderson’s compensation package as an increase, saying it “may” increase.


“He’s getting less cash and the other stuff that he’s getting may or may not pay out, and if it does pay out, it will pay out over a period of years,” she said.


Gee, what a fucking surprise. You left those sentences out. And gee, stock options may or may not go up in price. Amazing. :eyes:

Man, such dishonest bullshit and cherry picking. Tsk tsk. At least you admit you're a clown. Now DANCE clown! Dance! :rofl:
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 09:14 AM
Response to Reply #237
238. Delete
Edited on Fri Oct-23-09 09:15 AM by Beetwasher
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #237
243. "Henderson’s total compensation package will INCREASE to about $5.5 million...."
Hmmm, didn't I mention this possibility upthread, only to be accosted with the most juvenile and crass insults? :shrug:

http://freep.com/article/20091022/BUSINESS01/91022070/1319/New-rules-cost-GM-s-Henderson-cash-but-may-hike-his-pay
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #243
245. "May or may not"
Edited on Fri Oct-23-09 10:35 AM by Beetwasher
Why do you dishonestly leave that out. It's stock options, Einstein. They go up, they go down. He has to perform and make the company successful. I got no problems w/ that.



Henderson’s total compensation package will increase to about $5.5 million under terms of the pay plan, a person familiar with the documents said.


Henderson’s cash salary, which was $1.26 million, is being decreased by 25% to $950,000. He will receive stock and restricted stock in GM valued at about $4.2 million.


Julie Gibson, a GM spokeswoman, cautioned against looking at Henderson’s compensation package as an increase, saying it “may” increase.


“He’s getting less cash and the other stuff that he’s getting may or may not pay out, and if it does pay out, it will pay out over a period of years,” she said.


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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #245
246. Stock options have a present value. That's my last comment to you. nt
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 10:36 AM
Response to Reply #246
247. Yup, And Right Now GM's Stock Is Pretty Fucking Shitty
And you'll notice they don't say his options would CURRENTLY be valued at that figure, do they? I wonder why THAT is?

Now dance clown! Dance! And then run away! :rofl:
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Romulox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #237
249. Fritz Henderson was GM's Chief Financial Officer (CFO) from 2006 to GM's collapse, btw.
Just so everyone understands the kind of "talent" in question! :hi:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Henderson
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Beetwasher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-23-09 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #249
251. Well Then, He Better Peform Now Or His Stock Options Will CONTINUE To Be Worthless
Just so everyone understands that's how stock options work, since this poster seems to be clueless about that and pushing bullshit spin.
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NYC_SKP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-26-09 09:01 PM
Response to Original message
253. Corporatist...
Or so some say... :eyes:
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johnaries Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-26-09 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
254. But..., but..., isn't that *gasp* Socialist?
:rofl:
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