2016 Postmortem

Bettie

(18,743 posts)

179. I disagree

Sun Jan 8, 2017, 05:52 PM

Jan 2017

I supported Sanders in the primary. I think he has a good message overall.

However, on this he is not correct.

The Out of Touch thing is probably true to some extent, but in the end, it was a very tiny piece of a whole lot of things that were problematic.

Cross Check did more damage this election.

Voter Suppression of other sorts (ID laws, broken machines, etc.) did more damage

Propaganda did much more damage

Comey, coming out at the 11th hour when it was looking like the aforementioned items weren't working.

Even with all of this, she still won the popular vote and nearly won the EC. That is not a message that is out of touch, except to people who will not listen to the message because it is being delivered by a woman who has had a 25+ year campaign against her delivered non-stop.

Orange Groper ran on racism and hate. Sadly, there's way more of that out there than I thought and you can not reach people for whom this is the primary motivation, unless you are willing to throw all of the people they hate and fear under the bus.

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Bernie Sanders Says Trump Won Because Democrats Are Out Of Touch [View all] portlander23 Jan 2017 OP

I'm getting really tired of this meme. blue cat Jan 2017 #1

now you know. WhiteTara Jan 2017 #17

So am I DFW Jan 2017 #33

it is like we don't have the house or the Senate or the Presidency. It is like the reason we have a JCanete Jan 2017 #43

OLIGARCHY!! George II Jan 2017 #49

What?? DFW Jan 2017 #62

is it actually a joke though? Would Republicans be able to steal elections without the help of the JCanete Jan 2017 #66

Did he miss Hillary going to diners, schools, retirement centers, job sites? LisaM Jan 2017 #61

If Sanders was so brilliant why couldn't he win the primary? Cary Jan 2017 #123

Well the Dems ARE out of touch...hey, we lost everything ..states and fed government MaeScott Jan 2017 #158

Exactly. tecelote Jan 2017 #177

Trump won because racist Rust Belt voters... SidDithers Jan 2017 #2

this Grey Lemercier Jan 2017 #7

Or because of the FBI, Putin, Assange WhiteTara Jan 2017 #18

It couldnt have had anything to do with Separation Jan 2017 #26

And they've admitted it in quite a few interviews mcar Jan 2017 #39

Exactly!!! The Trump win was based on Racism and Bigotry!!! I don't get why so many back off RKP5637 Jan 2017 #52

trump only won MI by 10K votes. There were more votes than that not even counted in Detroit putitinD Jan 2017 #53

DEM voters in the primary, not the racist repugs. Quite a difference. brush Jan 2017 #59

Hillary most likely WON MI, had they counted all the votes. Detroit is a democratic stronghold. putitinD Jan 2017 #69

Yup, 75,000 votes in Detroit and Flint weren't counted. And you know most were Hillary votes brush Jan 2017 #71

Yeah, I mean all those visits Clinton made to Wisconsin Goblinmonger Jan 2017 #54

It's easy to take potshots from the cheap seats after the fact SFnomad Jan 2017 #116

Goblinmonger makes a valid point. golfguru Jan 2017 #127

It doesn't matter if the point is valid or not SFnomad Jan 2017 #139

In hind sight, she ignored Wisconsin, golfguru Jan 2017 #169

Re: She should have focused ... SFnomad Jan 2017 #170

Why did the same "racist" rust belters voted for Obama twice? golfguru Jan 2017 #126

most of them didn't . JI7 Jan 2017 #147

Wait a minute, Obama won PA twice. golfguru Jan 2017 #168

it was more due to non voters and trump getting racists that thought JI7 Jan 2017 #171

It's good that Sanders will keep after Trump. TheCowsCameHome Jan 2017 #3

He certainly didn't this morning when they counted electoral votes. George II Jan 2017 #51

Sanders did not object to the electoral college results Gothmog Jan 2017 #101

My point. That would have been a perfect opportunity to "keep after Trump". He didn't. George II Jan 2017 #106

We are in complete and total agreement as to that Gothmog Jan 2017 #111

No he won't. Tavarious Jackson Jan 2017 #109

Obama said pretty much the same thing. Dustlawyer Jan 2017 #4

Really? Do show us where.... nt MADem Jan 2017 #21

It wouldn't do any good. Google his statement about how he won Iowa he made Dustlawyer Jan 2017 #41

Extraordinary claims like those you make demand solid proof, not "go google." nt MADem Jan 2017 #79

I am pretty sure you looked it up but won't admit it. Dustlawyer Jan 2017 #129

I am pretty sure I didn't. But since you can't come up with a citation, I'll MADem Jan 2017 #131

Washington Post by Aaron Blake on 11/17. Dustlawyer Jan 2017 #136

You cut out the url and post it--it's easy. MADem Jan 2017 #149

Thanks for the tip. Dustlawyer Jan 2017 #150

You've got to give me a link in order for me to watch a video. MADem Jan 2017 #153

Back Cary Jan 2017 #125

Biden too: jonno99 Jan 2017 #60

Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2017 #143

Bernie, Bernie, Bernie Zoonart Jan 2017 #5

it is NOT "Bernie hate" whatsoever when I now call him out for aiding in the minimisation Grey Lemercier Jan 2017 #6

Good post. Why is "broken record Bernie" ignoring all the real reasons that you stated? brush Jan 2017 #63

If Bernie is a Democrat, then he has just admitted that he is out of touch with the voters. TexasTowelie Jan 2017 #8

He is not a Democrat--he has said this. He is an independent who caucuses with the Democrats. MADem Jan 2017 #22

I'm aware of his independent status TexasTowelie Jan 2017 #35

I agree with your assessment. nt MADem Jan 2017 #154

Oh Geeze otohara Jan 2017 #137

You keep fighting that primary. nt Dr Hobbitstein Jan 2017 #9

Correct Me. Jan 2017 #65

Why did you lose the primary, oh most wise one? randome Jan 2017 #10

Maybe to give TheCowsCameHome Jan 2017 #14

Check with Debbie for your answer on this one. ciaobaby Jan 2017 #103

People here are in denial... Whiskeytide Jan 2017 #11

I think she lost because we are all tired of politicians from the 1990s. randome Jan 2017 #13

Unless it is HRC or EW. TheCowsCameHome Jan 2017 #32

I'm 58, close enough, and I don't want anyone my age or older telling us what to do. randome Jan 2017 #47

As for your first paragraph. NCTraveler Jan 2017 #15

The popular vote ... Whiskeytide Jan 2017 #27

This crazycatlady Jan 2017 #16

Bank account? His voters averaged 70k and are "seething" about money only because they despise bettyellen Jan 2017 #23

I didn't necessarily say ... Whiskeytide Jan 2017 #28

Live in California, make 70k for a family of four, and see how far that gets you. SlimJimmy Jan 2017 #95

Racism and sexism were the biggest predictors of a Trump vote. I'll grant you it overlaps with bettyellen Jan 2017 #99

I absolutely, but respecfully, disagree with your assessment. SlimJimmy Jan 2017 #130

As long as this chasing WWC idea does not include "setting aside" the rights and justice bettyellen Jan 2017 #132

Here's the problem. YOU and other progressives keep focusing SlimJimmy Jan 2017 #134

No, I am complaining about the media's focus on the WWC - did you miss all the round tables bettyellen Jan 2017 #138

I gave you the last word, you didn't do much wth it. Want to expand your answer? SlimJimmy Jan 2017 #141

actually the working class minorities voted for Clinton in the primaries JI7 Jan 2017 #156

They didn't seem to vote for her in the general. What happened? SlimJimmy Jan 2017 #166

they did vote for her in the general. only reason it's ignored us because some think only white JI7 Jan 2017 #173

And therein lies the problem. Many non-white working class in this country have also SlimJimmy Jan 2017 #178

lol. Buden is very pro big banks and credit card companies JI7 Jan 2017 #180

Well, we just disagree on this one. Clearly, I'm not going to change your view. SlimJimmy Jan 2017 #184

most families in california make much less than that . JI7 Jan 2017 #148

My brother lives and works in California and makes about 60k a year. To be honest, he is SlimJimmy Jan 2017 #167

it's not too difficult but you have limited options for type of housing JI7 Jan 2017 #172

With the price of housing in meropolitan areas of California, that's easy to understand. SlimJimmy Jan 2017 #175

That really depends on where in California you live SFnomad Jan 2017 #174

He lives in the Fresno area and housing there is quite expensive compared to the rest of the SlimJimmy Jan 2017 #176

and he lost california JI7 Jan 2017 #181

Yes he did. Badly. But did you really think the "Donald" was ever going to win there? SlimJimmy Jan 2017 #185

Navin R. Johnson was a jerk! George II Jan 2017 #88

You are 100% Correct ciaobaby Jan 2017 #105

Good post, but denial is too powerful for many here realmirage Jan 2017 #135

Bernie has become a songbird with an incoherent message. Nt NCTraveler Jan 2017 #12

Bernie is correct, of course. earthside Jan 2017 #19

While I think Sanders is right, Democrats were right to champion transgender bathroom rights. JCanete Jan 2017 #50

That may be the most succinct statement ... Whiskeytide Jan 2017 #120

He's just wrong. Trump won because Putin helped him and we've got a shitload of racists in USA. MADem Jan 2017 #20

Bingo. I think sexism was actually THE factor in Hilary's defeat. stopbush Jan 2017 #24

Correct. greatauntoftriplets Jan 2017 #144

That UPSHOT was a BRIGHT SPOT for you--who needs hating racists cluttering up your MADem Jan 2017 #146

Still I wonder what made her so hateful. greatauntoftriplets Jan 2017 #159

Fear, maybe? MADem Jan 2017 #160

I just don't know. greatauntoftriplets Jan 2017 #161

I don't really know, either. MADem Jan 2017 #164

Apparently so. greatauntoftriplets Jan 2017 #165

Bad time for a book tour, Sanders. Put the country first for fucks sake. bettyellen Jan 2017 #25

He does put the country first. TheCowsCameHome Jan 2017 #34

He talks the talk, fitting his square peg in every round hole out there... bettyellen Jan 2017 #36

How does he walk the walk? BainsBane Jan 2017 #85

Unless there's a book deal in the offing. lapucelle Jan 2017 #183

He needs the money. Trying to flog that book, but it's not working too well. MADem Jan 2017 #155

He's still out there taking on Trump, Wall St., and the deplorables. TheCowsCameHome Jan 2017 #186

Sanders lost because he failed utterly to appeal to voters beyond a narrow base of white voters Gothmog Jan 2017 #29

And money BainsBane Jan 2017 #93

Sanders was running for media coverage and got it Gothmog Jan 2017 #94

More Sunday show appearances than any other candidate by far bettyellen Jan 2017 #162

Twice as many as the next person Gothmog Jan 2017 #163

Post removed Post removed Jan 2017 #30

Sure, but Republican leaders are even further out of touch. Orsino Jan 2017 #31

Bernie only gives credit to Bernie and denigrates other Dems who've worked hard for us. bettyellen Jan 2017 #37

Some, obviously, will never forgive him for primarying Clinton... Orsino Jan 2017 #38

No, The Systems Not Totally Rigged. But That Idea Sure Helped Donald Trump. Gothmog Jan 2017 #46

I did not think his run was any more of an ego trip than it was for Hillary- bettyellen Jan 2017 #56

I hope this guy is not seeking a comeback. nt oasis Jan 2017 #40

Take your whining and go piss up a rope, Bernie. Enough, already. (nt) Paladin Jan 2017 #42

The Russians and 65M Americans would disagree. GeorgeGist Jan 2017 #44

Sanders ran solely for media coverage and the latest comments continue this pattern Gothmog Jan 2017 #45

Again today? Do you read DU, particularly this? George II Jan 2017 #48

I think the fact that Hillary made millions on speeches to Wall Street really hurt her. jalan48 Jan 2017 #55

Trump did not win. Hillary did with almost 3 million more votes. onecaliberal Jan 2017 #57

Huh? Mike Nelson Jan 2017 #58

Trump is a billionaire who wants to do away with the minimum wage Nick Otean Jan 2017 #64

Sanders has had nothing nice to say about Trump. This is the problem with comments being taken JCanete Jan 2017 #70

He's had very little nice to say about Clinton or Democrats in general. George II Jan 2017 #74

You have a problem with Jehovah's Witnesses? George II Jan 2017 #75

hahaha! just pamphlet covers with carnivores being ridden by children...like what do they eat now?nt JCanete Jan 2017 #80

Double down. George II Jan 2017 #82

I don't like opportunists who use my party when they need something lapucelle Jan 2017 #67

I couldn't care less what Sanders says NastyRiffraff Jan 2017 #68

Democrats need to advance candidates well versed in making speeches oasis Jan 2017 #72

Are you referring to Obama ? Cause that is what was said when he was running ciaobaby Jan 2017 #107

"One of the reasons that Mr. Trump won is that we have millions of people.... George II Jan 2017 #73

Just saying more votes were cast does not mean a higher percentage of the voting public was involved JCanete Jan 2017 #78

Guess what? None those people born since 2012 voted. George II Jan 2017 #92

But the article does go on to say that there was a downtick of eligible voters who voted per capita. JCanete Jan 2017 #100

The complaints were that the DNC wasn't setting up registration tables at Sanders rallies.... George II Jan 2017 #104

Sanders seriously want to hold Trump to his nebulous campaign "promises"? Blue_Tires Jan 2017 #76

he's doing it to make Trump into a liar and hypocrite, and to continue to hammer that home for the JCanete Jan 2017 #81

Because Trump was already proven beyond all doubt to be a liar and hypocrite Blue_Tires Jan 2017 #89

Last I checked almost three million more Americans preferred the Dem candidate Blue_Tires Jan 2017 #77

That's helpful. TheCowsCameHome Jan 2017 #84

Or maybe... Blue_Tires Jan 2017 #90

PLEASE LISTEN TO THE ACTUAL INTERVIEW yodermon Jan 2017 #83

We've heard it all a million times BainsBane Jan 2017 #91

DC consultants. pansypoo53219 Jan 2017 #86

It's unfortunate that Sanders spends so much time attacking Democrats BainsBane Jan 2017 #87

Be prepared to lose again next time around. TheCowsCameHome Jan 2017 #96

To listen to him BainsBane Jan 2017 #98

Ok, go down the same path again. TheCowsCameHome Jan 2017 #108

I don't go down a path BainsBane Jan 2017 #113

This group seems incapable of coming together. ciaobaby Jan 2017 #102

Did you read the OP? BainsBane Jan 2017 #112

I sure did. ciaobaby Jan 2017 #114

There must be some mistake TheCowsCameHome Jan 2017 #115

Here's the thing BainsBane Jan 2017 #117

I am also a democratic. ciaobaby Jan 2017 #118

I find the Bernie bashing very sad womanofthehills Jan 2017 #152

Dear leader has never accomplished anything of note Dream Girl Jan 2017 #97

She lost. Get over it. (nt) PotatoChip Jan 2017 #142

Bernie who?? Lil Missy Jan 2017 #110

In other news... bonemachine Jan 2017 #119

Why is Sanders peddling RW talking points? baldguy Jan 2017 #121

Because he has no skin in the game La Lioness Priyanka Jan 2017 #122

Plus he's too old Cary Jan 2017 #124

And it sells books. George II Jan 2017 #128

bernie seems to fight the Democrats treestar Jan 2017 #133

This message was self-deleted by its author jalan48 Jan 2017 #140

Horse shit, Bernie. Adrahil Jan 2017 #145

And Bernie Sanders lost the primaries ... NanceGreggs Jan 2017 #151

Delusional Bullshit. DetlefK Jan 2017 #157

I disagree Bettie Jan 2017 #179

What a useless fucking thread this is redstateblues Jan 2017 #182