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jfz9580m

(15,830 posts)
11. Well it is a little more complicated
Mon Aug 18, 2025, 09:34 AM
Aug 18

I get the skepticism about conservative “concern”. The right helped delay action on climate change and their credibility is obviously suspect. I can’t even remember when it became too obvious for them to even stop insisting that it’s a hoax.

But green growth has its issues. It is a strategy by industrial groups who don’t like sustainability, but want continuous growth on a finite planet.

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/01/oil-companies-lithium-mining-rural-communities/

The area’s fortunes began to look up late last year, when ExxonMobil, alongside a couple of other companies, announced its intention to begin producing lithium in the region by 2027. It opened a test site on the Smackover formation, which spans three states, and is planning an operation that could process as much as 100,000 metric tons of the material annually. That’s about 15 percent of what the world produced in 2022, something that’s got folks in Lewisville cautiously hopeful that the change could turn things around.

“We are just very excited, trying to get all our ducks in a row and be able to take advantage of what’s coming,” said Dunbar-Jones, who has served on the city council for seven years.

ExxonMobil joins a growing rush to supply the natural resources needed to drive the green transition. Oil producers and coal companies like Ramaco Resources are looking to collaborate with the Department of Energy to uncover them and, in some cases, wring more money from land they already own.

Critical minerals extraction is subject to a relatively loose framework of regulations, and it can be quite destructive, said Marco Tedesco, a climate scientist at Columbia University who has researched its extraction worldwide. To exploit the Smackover formation, Exxon plans to tap the lithium-rich brine 10,000 feet below ground using a process called deep lithium extraction. “They pump lithium from the bottom—similar to fracking,” Tedesco said, adding that the process requires an immense amount of water. The brine evaporates, leaving lithium salts and other byproducts, some valuable and some toxic. “People living by a mine, they have a right to exploit this economic opportunity,” he said, but in practice, Tedesco sees most of the benefits leaving the communities where extraction happens.

Unfortunately, history is scattered with a
systematic disregard for transparency and a lack of accountability by corporations,” Tedesco said.

Water scarcity is a big topic in Wyoming, a cold, dry state with expansive strip mines, intensive fracking, and a growing industry in critical minerals. Coal has been tied to the identity of Gillette, a small town in the northeast corner of the state, for over 100 years. The Powder River Basin holds most of the nation’s recoverable reserves. Coal company Ramaco Resources, with the help of a Department of Energy national laboratory, discovered what may be the nation’s largest deposit of rare-earth metals on land it bought for $2 million in 2011. Rather than dig for coal, Ramaco will tap what it says will be a $37 billion bonanza in critical minerals.

Shannon Anderson, the staff attorney for the environmental organization Powder River Basin Resource Council, doesn’t see anything unusual in what Ramaco is doing. “Companies are really good at reinventing themselves when there’s a market opportunity to do that, ” she said, and the mining industry has been eager to join the clean energy supply chain. Research has shown that mine tailings, acid mine drainage, and other toxic coal waste may in fact be a decent source of critical minerals.

Despite his opposition to many of President Joe Biden’s clean energy policies, Senate Democrat Joe Manchin, who represents the coal-producing state of West Virginia, had little trouble pushing to bolster domestic critical minerals supplies, in hopes that might make mine waste profitable for coal companies. What has changed in Anderson’s 16 years of work are “the astronomical level of subsidies that are driving these decisions.”




That’s Mother Jones and Grist so they aren’t at all against green energy.

The climate scientist quoted in that article sounds more cautious than the area resident. So we’ll see..
The GOP has acted with such bad faith on all environmental issues including climate change that it can tend to obscure a second layer of conflict between people truly acting in good faith to protect the environment and or labor rights (these guys tend to not care about either-they think child labor is awesome) and those who are just exploiting greenwashing.

As I said it’s complicated. The hideousness of the GOP and social media/media in general have made processing of grey areas harder overall in the public mind.

Because of the constant hammering by Cato/Koch and libertarian think tanks, on the left we have a some (perfectly legit) wariness when people are “just askin questions”.
But it is some of the worst players and these guys are the kind to saddle us with a new crisis..they are truly depraved, amoral and mercenary. They bear watching.

The green transition would need to factor in more than green growth imo, but it doesn’t seem like industry will allow that.. we really need fewer people overall. And a transition to a slower, less consumption centred lifestyle, or it seems like it will be forced on us by theses guys running the show anyway. I feel like every dystopian scifi from Soylent Green to Elysium is fine by them.

It was ridiculous to not have family planning be a part of public health policy when infant mortality rates dropped. Especially given the religiosity on every corner of the planet (which by default promotes that quiverful stuff over any discussion of family planning). It is not a decision to take lightly and that’s more so now than ever as young people and children face an even more uncertain future than we did. Migration, reproduction, all way more complicated these days.

Cato and Koch also love that - cheap labor and consumption. And they won’t be there when Trump carts people off to El Salvador.



Edit: As the article notes, the Biden admin was sensitive to the need for regulation and protection of the environment and the needs of the communities involved. But under Trump, it would be full on pro creepy corporate interests and fuck the environment and the people.
We’ll see..

Recommendations

1 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

imagine having all that time on your hands and choosing to do THAT Skittles Aug 17 #1
Reprehensible piece of crap ...hurting everyone with her stupidity and arrogance JT45242 Aug 17 #2
So called "renewable energy" has nothing to do with fighting greenhouse gases. NNadir Aug 17 #4
While I know this won't be happily received here, I applaud her efforts to protect wilderness from development. NNadir Aug 17 #3
Renewable energy is seeing massive growth that nuclear cannot hope to compete with. VMA131Marine Aug 17 #5
It would be useful, if one were to actually believe this nonsense, to look at the Mauna Loa CO2 observatory data. NNadir Aug 18 #9
Where is COVID in the Mauna Loa data? Finishline42 Aug 18 #10
Actually, I intended this post for another thread but... NNadir Aug 19 #14
let me guess, you want to say the data a Mauna Loa is wrong? Finishline42 Aug 20 #19
Don't worry. Be happy. I hear all the time that solar and wind will save us. By the way, my lights went on and... NNadir Aug 20 #20
How fast could we build nuclear power plants? VMA131Marine Aug 19 #15
It actually would require something called "numbers" to dispose of this absurd argument. NNadir Aug 19 #16
I notice you didn't answer my question! VMA131Marine Aug 19 #17
I interpret my response quite differently. I don't regard numbers as Gish Gallop, but I am well aware that... NNadir Aug 20 #18
We're not going to save the world by trashing it. hunter Aug 17 #6
you've done your own research Skittles Aug 17 #8
Well it is a little more complicated jfz9580m Aug 18 #11
NNadir's post on Levelized Full System Costs of Electricity is a good one. hunter Aug 18 #12
Can't live forever. rickyhall Aug 17 #7
Here's a direct link without the social media tracking: hunter Aug 19 #13
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