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Environment & Energy
In reply to the discussion: Hydrogen cars 'are not the enemy' of electric vehicles as calls grow for more UK refuelling stations [View all]NNadir
(36,079 posts)5. Oh, and by the way, I always hear this bullshit about so called "nuclear waste" from people defending the indefensible.
In response, I remind people so carrying on with their deadly selective attention, that 19,000 people die every day from fossil fuel waste.
Global burden of 87 risk factors in 204 countries and territories, 19902019: a systematic analysis for the Global Burden of Disease Study 2019 (Lancet Volume 396, Issue 10258, 1723 October 2020, Pages 1223-1249). This study is a huge undertaking and the list of authors from around the world is rather long. These studies are always open sourced; and I invite people who want to carry on about Fukushima to open it and search the word "radiation." It appears once. Radon, a side product brought to the surface by fracking while we all wait for the grand so called "renewable energy" nirvana that did not come, is not here and won't come, appears however: Household radon, from the decay of natural uranium, which has been cycling through the environment ever since oxygen appeared in the Earth's atmosphere.
Here is what it says about air pollution deaths in the 2019 Global Burden of Disease Survey, if one is too busy to open it oneself because one is too busy carrying on about Fukushima:
Here is what it says about air pollution deaths in the 2019 Global Burden of Disease Survey, if one is too busy to open it oneself because one is too busy carrying on about Fukushima:
The top five risks for attributable deaths for females were high SBP (5·25 million [95% UI 4·496·00] deaths, or 20·3% [17·522·9] of all female deaths in 2019), dietary risks (3·48 million [2·784·37] deaths, or 13·5% [10·816·7] of all female deaths in 2019), high FPG (3·09 million [2·403·98] deaths, or 11·9% [9·415·3] of all female deaths in 2019), air pollution (2·92 million [2·533·33] deaths or 11·3% [10·012·6] of all female deaths in 2019), and high BMI (2·54 million [1·683·56] deaths or 9·8% [6·513·7] of all female deaths in 2019). For males, the top five risks differed slightly. In 2019, the leading Level 2 risk factor for attributable deaths globally in males was tobacco (smoked, second-hand, and chewing), which accounted for 6·56 million (95% UI 6·027·10) deaths (21·4% [20·522·3] of all male deaths in 2019), followed by high SBP, which accounted for 5·60 million (4·906·29) deaths (18·2% [16·220·1] of all male deaths in 2019). The third largest Level 2 risk factor for attributable deaths among males in 2019 was dietary risks (4·47 million [3·655·45] deaths, or 14·6% [12·017·6] of all male deaths in 2019) followed by air pollution (ambient particulate matter and ambient ozone pollution, accounting for 3·75 million [3·314·24] deaths (12·2% [11·013·4] of all male deaths in 2019), and then high FPG (3·14 million [2·704·34] deaths, or 11·1% [8·914·1] of all male deaths in 2019).
I then ask them to show - insisting that only reference to the acceptable primary scientific literature - that in the now 70 year history of commercial nuclear power, that the storage of used nuclear fuel for that period has killed as many people as will die in the next 8 hours from air pollution. That would be a little over 6 thousand people.
I never get an answer, although I often get the subject changed with really, really oblivious rhetoric.
The economics of nuclear power, given that nuclear reactors are designed to run for 80 years, is obviated by the simple comparison of numbers. One does not even need to compare the economic costs of the destruction of the planetary atmosphere about which bourgeois antinukes couldn't care less, to see the cost to poor people of antinukism. The real time numbers are readily available to anyone who looks, as I pointed out here:
So much for "Nuclear Energy Is Too Expensive."
Used nuclear fuel is a valuable resource for all future generations, particularly because it contains plutonium with an acceptable isotopic vector. I argue that all of the fission products are valuable materials.
As for this bullshit about "forever," it's garbage from people who have a limited understanding of mathematics, since fission products, and indeed actinides, are subject to secular equilibrium defined by the Bateman equation.

By reference to this equation one can easily establish that unlike the mercury and lead released by fossil fuel combustion, as well, of course, the carbon dioxide, about which antinukes also couldn't care less (they're burning coal in antinuke Germany) that nuclear materials can only accumulate to a maxima to a point at which they are being destroyed at the same rate as they are formed.
It can be shown, as I have referenced here, 828 Underground Nuclear Tests, Plutonium Migration in Nevada, Dunning, Kruger, Strawmen, and Tunnels that nuclear power has the possibly less than desirable outcome of reducing the natural radioactivity of the planet:
The following figure shows the very different case obtained if one separates the uranium, plutonium and minor actinides (neptunium, americium and curium) and fissions them, whereupon the reduction of radioactivity to a level that is actually below that of the original uranium in a little over 300 years:

The caption:
(Hartwig Freiesleben, The European Physical Journal Conferences · June 2013)
Source 17, in German, is this one: Reduzierung der Radiotoxizität abgebrannter Kernbrennstoffe durch Abtrennung und Transmutation von Actiniden: Partitioning. Reducing spent nuclear fuel radiotoxicity by actinide separation and transmutation: partitioning.
It is important to note that simply because a material is radioactive does not imply that it is not useful, perhaps even capable of accomplishing tasks that nothing else can do as well or as sustainably. Given the level of chemical pollution of the air, water and land, in fact, the use of radiation, in particular high energy radiation, gamma rays, x-rays, and ultra UV radiation may prove to be more important than ever, but that's a topic for another time.

The caption:
Fig. 4. Radiotoxicity (log-scale, unit: Sv/tSM) of 1 t of heavy metal (SM) from a pressurized water reactor (initial enrichment 4.2% U-235, burn-up 50 GWd/t) with regard to ingestion as a function of time (log-scale, unit: years) after discharge. Left-hand frame: contribution of fission products (FP), plutonium (Pu) and minor actinides (MA) to radiotoxicity. Right-hand frame: Modification of radiotoxicity due to separation of U, Pu or U, Pu, MA. The reference value is the radiotoxicity of the amount of natural uranium that was used to produce 1 t of nuclear fuel. Source: [17].
(Hartwig Freiesleben, The European Physical Journal Conferences · June 2013)
Source 17, in German, is this one: Reduzierung der Radiotoxizität abgebrannter Kernbrennstoffe durch Abtrennung und Transmutation von Actiniden: Partitioning. Reducing spent nuclear fuel radiotoxicity by actinide separation and transmutation: partitioning.
It is important to note that simply because a material is radioactive does not imply that it is not useful, perhaps even capable of accomplishing tasks that nothing else can do as well or as sustainably. Given the level of chemical pollution of the air, water and land, in fact, the use of radiation, in particular high energy radiation, gamma rays, x-rays, and ultra UV radiation may prove to be more important than ever, but that's a topic for another time.
Antinuke rhetoric and selective attention is fucking killing the planet. It's burning up. It is not only scientifically illiterate, it is, perhaps more importantly, morally abhorrent.
Have a nice day.
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Hydrogen cars 'are not the enemy' of electric vehicles as calls grow for more UK refuelling stations [View all]
Caribbeans
Jun 6
OP
Hydrogen is only slightly more stupid than batteries. The idea that storing energy is "green" is pernicious bullshit.
NNadir
Jun 6
#1
I am really, tired, as we just passed 430 ppm of concentrations CO2, of the substitution of the word "could" for "is."
NNadir
Jun 7
#3
You are maximizing costs of wind/solar and minimizing costs and risks of nuclear.
thought crime
Jun 7
#4
Nuclear energy vastly out produces, in units of energy (Exajoules) the combined trillion dollar solar and wind garbage.
NNadir
Jun 7
#6
Oh my fucking Gawd!!!!! Denial and soothsaying AGAIN! I've been listening to soothsaying about...
NNadir
Jun 7
#10