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hfojvt

(37,573 posts)
Wed Jan 2, 2013, 01:30 PM Jan 2013

Why I really hate this deal [View all]

I am being told the deal is not that bad because it is not that different from where Obama started.

But what if Obama did NOT start at a very good point?

In discussing the deal, Krugman writes this "Obama wasn’t going to let all the Bush tax cuts go away in any case; only the high-end cuts were on the table."

and leaves out the word "very". Becuase the high end cuts were not on the table, only the VERY high end cuts.

As I have said over and over again, Obama's STARTING point was "tax cuts that favor the rich". He started from a point of keeping 78% of the Bush tax cuts and finished at the point of keeping 85% of them. From start to finish this whole business favored the top 30% over the bottom 70%.

Once again, nothing very progressive is even "on the table". It is a battle between Democrats fighting for big tax cuts for the "haves" and Republicans fighting for big tax cuts for the "have mores".

It is what I always said about the Bush tax cuts. They were not just for the super rich, they were for the rich as well. The top 1% got 26% of them, but the top 4% got 13.4% of them, compared to 7.4% that went to the bottom 40%. Which is even more uneven if you look at dollar figures. $10,000 for those close to the top and $241 for those in the bottom.

That is what Obama proposed to keep to help the "middle class". As if members of the top 5% are part of the middle class.

I don't considere members of the top 20% to be part of the middle class either. They are above 80% of the rest of us, and they did well by Obama. 26% of the Bush tax cuts went to the 80-95th percentile. Tax cuts that give over $100 billion to the top 20% and only $15 billion to the bottom 20% are simply not progressive.

That the Democratic Party is embracing them now, shows the dominance of the Reagan ideology of tax cuts, and the Democratic Party's abandonment of the lower working classes.

So, Obama started from a point where he made huge concessions to the Republicans and the rich. Anything better was NOT "on the table".

Then he made even more concessions.

And in return he got - unemployment benefits.

The expiring tax cuts were a sword of Damocles hanging over the Republicans heads. Something which could have been used to protect the big three in future debt ceiling negotiations or that would eliminate future debt ceiling negotiations.

Instead of getting something for his hostages, Obama just snatched the sword away so he can head into February with no leverage. Unless the threat of default is some sort of leverage. It was not worth much in the last round.

In 2010, Obama punted on first down and promised that he would fight next time. With no re-election to worry about, it still looks to me like Obama punted on 2nd down.

Or even reminds me of another Joe. Joe Pisarcik of the New York Giants. Instead of just taking a knee and letting the Bush tax cuts expire, Joe opts to hand the ball off, fumbles, and the other team scores a touchdown.

And now we are supposed to cheer. 85% of the Bush tax cuts got extended!!! Permanently!! What a victory for progressives.

The tax code is much less progressive than it was before Bush and less progressive than it would have been if the Bush tax cuts had been allowed to die.

And now there is no HOPE of CHANGING it.

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Why I really hate this deal [View all] hfojvt Jan 2013 OP
No I don't agree at all Harmony Blue Jan 2013 #1
mo, actially taxes were once again CUT for the top 2% hfojvt Jan 2013 #9
Why are you putting this in our beautiful minds? leftstreet Jan 2013 #2
I realize you don't mean it that way Harmony Blue Jan 2013 #3
The new Jobs Program will lead to better economic conditions leftstreet Jan 2013 #5
I am probably the most progressive person you will ever meet Harmony Blue Jan 2013 #7
Somehow I doubt that leftstreet Jan 2013 #25
GOP filibustered 3 Jobs Bills. JaneyVee Jan 2013 #38
Exactly! LP2K12 Jan 2013 #18
That is why the payroll tax holiday is expiring Harmony Blue Jan 2013 #28
Understandable... LP2K12 Jan 2013 #48
the only thing that lapses in 5 years time hfojvt Jan 2013 #10
What tax cuts for the "rich" are permanent? Harmony Blue Jan 2013 #13
check out the table on the right side of the last page hfojvt Jan 2013 #26
Sorry I don't agree at all Harmony Blue Jan 2013 #27
We the Serfs, debating the difference btwn wealthy and rich leftstreet Jan 2013 #32
No difference to me... Chan790 Jan 2013 #39
I think it was Chris Rock who said MindPilot Jan 2013 #59
last Novemeber I ran for office hfojvt Jan 2013 #35
"I don't considere members of the top 20% to be part of the middle class either." ProSense Jan 2013 #4
Obama put the original goalposts in a bad place hfojvt Jan 2013 #12
This message was self-deleted by its author OKNancy Jan 2013 #6
it's an awful deal, totally unnecessary except to set up the next manufactured crisis.... mike_c Jan 2013 #8
I totally disagree CentristLiberal Jan 2013 #11
welcome to DU OKNancy Jan 2013 #14
What is positive about making 85% of the Bush tax cuts permanent? hfojvt Jan 2013 #16
Getting rid of the Bush tax cuts would kill the economic recovery CentristLiberal Jan 2013 #29
I agree 100% Harmony Blue Jan 2013 #31
Thank You, and Welcome! It's ridiculous, but like John Boehner, the left can't take "yes"..... Tarheel_Dem Jan 2013 #36
ooh, professional economists hfojvt Jan 2013 #42
I bet there's good reason you're not qualified to "be on NPR". Tarheel_Dem Jan 2013 #44
ooh, snap, but you trust the experts hfojvt Jan 2013 #45
Hey! Write a long letter to Bernie Sanders and Dennis Kucinich about it! Oh wait........... Tarheel_Dem Jan 2013 #46
nice Republican talking point hfojvt Jan 2013 #41
I wanted the cutoff to be much lower CentristLiberal Jan 2013 #50
Permanent just means no sunset... Chan790 Jan 2013 #40
oh, is that all hfojvt Jan 2013 #43
I have never seen it this bad on DU Harmony Blue Jan 2013 #20
but it is a FACT hfojvt Jan 2013 #24
actually what he did was CUT taxes for the rich hfojvt Jan 2013 #15
hfojvt Harmony Blue Jan 2013 #17
an increase in taxes from what starting point? hfojvt Jan 2013 #21
I understand your anger CentristLiberal Jan 2013 #52
it was very possible to hfojvt Jan 2013 #60
Your username seems Oxymoronic to me... Melinda Jan 2013 #23
It's the first name combo that wasn't taken. CentristLiberal Jan 2013 #30
I actually googled "centrist liberal" after I posted to you... Melinda Jan 2013 #47
Wow CentristLiberal Jan 2013 #51
lmao... see what you have done? Melinda Jan 2013 #53
Wipe that smirk off your face. Eddie Haskell Jan 2013 #49
yeah it's not so great limpyhobbler Jan 2013 #19
100% agree, I hate this deal! Eddie Haskell Jan 2013 #22
hfojvt's analysis is correct PufPuf23 Jan 2013 #33
That's how we got screwed LWolf Jan 2013 #34
It's awful ain't it? Why, oh why didn't we elect Jill, or Roseanne, or Rocky? WHY? Tarheel_Dem Jan 2013 #37
Thank you No Compromise Jan 2013 #54
yeah, and LarryO was the "liberal" praising the Bush tax cuts hfojvt Jan 2013 #57
We're Doomed, Doomed I tell you!!!! JoePhilly Jan 2013 #55
Here's is ProSense Jan 2013 #56
you link to some of the White House's lies hfojvt Jan 2013 #58
kick No Compromise Jan 2013 #61
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