General Discussion

EdmondDantes_

(515 posts)

55. Again, that's not a sustainable model

Fri May 30, 2025, 01:43 PM

May 30

The planet doesn't have the resources for all 8 billion to live like Americans or western Europe, much less if we have to keep increasing the population.

There are things we can cut, military spending for example. But yes it will also require changes to the social safety net whether it's retiring later or making people save more (whether through increased social security withholding or enforced 401k savings), or moving away from our current health insurance model. But pretending there's limitless resources and endless growth is possible isn't compatible with the planet. The only thing that grows endlessly is cancer and that kills the host.

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Crunchy Frog synni defacto7 RandomNumbers Chilopsis

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Highlight:

What will happen if(when?) the birthrate drops dramatically? [View all] LAS14 May 29 OP

Isn't that why Trump and co. want to pay women to have babies? ananda May 29 #1

Yes, but if you read the interview, you see that it's a real problem. nt LAS14 May 29 #5

I do see that. ananda May 29 #15

No, it isn't. Why are you falling for right-wing bullshit? valleyrogue May 29 #24

Douthat is NYT's token republican right winger. defacto7 May 30 #79

I can't get into the article. Why is it a problem? yardwork May 31 #93

Pay white women to have babies. White women. mucholderthandirt May 30 #74

Well, I'd appreciate it if they'd pay me for giving birth to twins Crunchy Frog May 30 #78

That's an interesting take. ananda May 31 #105

Only white women. They want to keep whites as the majority. kerry-is-my-prez May 31 #100

Exactly! ananda May 31 #104

The Earth might breathe a sigh of relief? flvegan May 29 #2

Right. The earth is way too overpopulated now. raccoon May 29 #6

The earth might, but if you read the interview, you'll get the idea that humanity might not. nt LAS14 May 29 #7

i'm cool with that...if the other species get to survive. ret5hd May 30 #26

We're really going to go full Handmaids Tale on DU behind forced-birther Douthat's column? Prairie Gates May 29 #3

People can't afford to have children pcdb May 29 #17

Why is that scary? LearnedHand May 29 #4

Too little population to support civilization. Read the article. nt LAS14 May 29 #8

So, when did human civilization first begin, Crunchy Frog May 30 #29

Long time ago and when there wasn't a policy system of younger people supporting older people uponit7771 May 30 #31

The issue is our economy is built around growth EdmondDantes_ May 30 #33

Yes, it's time to begin seriously thinking about new economic models. Crunchy Frog May 30 #36

This is incompatible with liberalism. Self Esteem May 30 #41

Again, that's not a sustainable model EdmondDantes_ May 30 #55

Nope. Self Esteem May 30 #56

The Earth is not "just fine". NickB79 May 30 #71

Sure it is. Self Esteem May 30 #73

I'll probably get thrown out of here for this, but, Conjuay May 31 #89

If you want to support the social safety yet - yes that's the only answer. Self Esteem May 31 #99

So making ever greater quantities of junk Crunchy Frog May 30 #75

You're making an argument that isn't being made. Self Esteem May 31 #101

You accuse me of throwing out meaningless strawmen, then throw in meaningless stories about US cities. Crunchy Frog Jun 1 #107

Incorrect Self Esteem Jun 1 #114

TLDR, putting you on ignore now. Crunchy Frog Jun 1 #115

lmao...slink away. Self Esteem Jun 1 #116

No, it is not. RandomNumbers May 31 #88

Overpopulation is not the issue. Self Esteem May 31 #103

Capitalism also demands endless growth Retrograde May 30 #53

Civilization can maintain. The Plague proved that. haele May 30 #70

More like too much population that can't be supported on the limited resources this planet has. mwmisses4289 May 30 #58

The "survival of the planet"? The Earth is not "alive" but has living things on it that can die. elocs May 31 #83

Normally when people say "survival of the planet" RandomNumbers May 31 #96

I'll take the truth & honesty over rhetorical shorthand any day. elocs May 31 #97

You're calling someone "dishonest" RandomNumbers May 31 #98

I was asking why you said the falling birthrate was scary, not what the article said LearnedHand May 29 #10

Not enough young working folks to support an aging population.... Happy Hoosier May 30 #46

Yes to your last sentence RandomNumbers May 31 #86

Ross Douthat?? A right wing hack. madinmaryland May 29 #9

I don't know RJ-MacReady May 29 #11

Could you explain a little more? nt LAS14 May 29 #12

Not really RJ-MacReady May 30 #39

Douthat is not a scientist, anthropologist, statistician, or sociologist. There is no reason to take what he says WhiskeyGrinder May 29 #13

He was interviewing a person who had studied this issue extensively. nt LAS14 May 29 #14

Ha, that's on me, for drinking on a Thursday night. What do you find scary about it all? WhiskeyGrinder May 29 #16

Here's a fairly recent study from The Lancet TheProle May 29 #18

doesnt the workforce make things for ppl? wont fewer ppl need fewer products? mopinko May 29 #21

need vs want Retrograde May 30 #57

since 60% of americans mopinko May 30 #59

LOL. AI is going to make all of us obsolete anyway. The last thing we need is more people to Scrivener7 May 30 #37

Handmaids. milestogo May 29 #19

The article says the birth rate hasn't declined as much with muslims questionseverything May 29 #20

Disney parks and eating out will be a helluva lot more enjoyable. BannonsLiver May 29 #22

LOL!!!!! valleyrogue May 29 #23

Alice Evans appears to be a lunatic (not to mention an idiot as well) Wiz Imp May 30 #25

No, there are some who agree with her. Don't ask me who, because I'm not going to go seek Scrivener7 May 30 #38

Governments around the world are trying to find ways to replace their populations. nt LAS14 May 30 #48

That sounds extremely dangerous. MorbidButterflyTat May 30 #67

Well, we're not. We're imprisoning and deporting immigrants. yardwork May 31 #94

If you keep going backwards jumping 1000 years, the world was always surviving with fewer people and if the RoeVWade May 30 #27

I think Elon talks about it quite a bit Crunchy Frog May 30 #28

Not sure when we reached 1 billion, but we reached 4 billion around 1980, and in just the following Cloudhopper May 30 #30

The world population reached one billion in the early years of the 1800s. Crunchy Frog May 30 #35

obviously there was no innovation and no economic growth DBoon May 30 #54

Automation will fill in where humans can't uponit7771 May 30 #32

Meh. When I was born the population of the USA was about 180 million. Today it's twice that. Scrivener7 May 30 #34

The thing of it is, more women are not going for men at all. valleyrogue May 30 #61

Yes. Because for the first time in history, they don't have to. That's a good thing. Scrivener7 May 30 #62

I think pro-natalism is the wrong path. Oneironaut May 30 #40

Kudos for taking the question seriously and proposing a path forward. nt LAS14 May 30 #49

Going with, appreciate MORE who is here and not act like just churning out workers? Brainfodder May 30 #42

I only scanned the article, but... LudwigPastorius May 30 #43

I see that a lot of people assume that bringing attention to a problem is the same thing... LAS14 May 30 #44

what problem though? RJ-MacReady May 30 #45

Did you read the article? nt LAS14 May 30 #47

Yes I did RJ-MacReady May 30 #52

This is DU where there is no requirement to actually read an article to respond to it elocs May 31 #84

Endless population growth is a problem ITAL May 30 #50

Thanks for this. For acknowledging a problem and not leaping onto the... LAS14 May 30 #64

Elbow room lame54 May 30 #51

A much saner view of the topic which correctly points out that it is nothing remotely to fear. Wiz Imp May 30 #60

Interesting points. Thanks. nt LAS14 May 30 #65

+1 leftstreet May 30 #66

Make the old people take care of the babies, Crunchy Frog May 30 #80

Human population decline is a very good thing for the biosphere Mysterian May 31 #90

So women are supposed to get pregnant chowmama May 30 #63

The interview did not propose a solution. It simply described... LAS14 Jun 1 #113

Manufacturing fear MorbidButterflyTat May 30 #68

Climate change is expected to kill 10's, maybe 100's of millions Kaleva May 30 #69

Food insecurity (starvation) and declining health due to Mango Menace policies will do far worse damage dickthegrouch May 30 #72

Could be, could be. nt LAS14 Jun 1 #112

We allow in more immigrants, that's what we do. viva la May 30 #76

Supposedly it already has. Littlered May 30 #77

Evolution has no direction. Maybe the survivors will shrink to Hobbit size and learn how to live and let live. Ping Tung May 30 #81

We should be so lucky Raine May 31 #82

Same as it ever was ... the rich get richer, the poor suffer RandomNumbers May 31 #85

Thanks for the thoughtful and insightful response!! nt LAS14 Jun 1 #111

There Are Many Threats to Humanity. A Low Birth Rate Isn't One of Them. RandomNumbers May 31 #87

Thanks for a response that addresses the question, not the personalties. nt LAS14 Jun 1 #110

Such nonsense. 8 billion people in the world. travelingthrulife May 31 #91

Islam eventually takes over the world madville May 31 #92

Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world. yardwork May 31 #95

I liked the article, but I don't think it has solutions. gulliver May 31 #102

It absolutely doesn't have solutions. That's why I found it scary. LAS14 Jun 1 #109

More right-wing bullshit. Aristus May 31 #106

Aha! An answer that addresses the question, not the people articulating it. Thanks. LAS14 Jun 1 #108