was a calculated attempt to both sides this report.
i honestly dont know who/what to believe any more, but his piece doesnt hold water, imo. mostly hamas sources. full of the same old libels.

posting on their own media. And we all saw the “victory marches” carrying victims to Gaza.

And who can forget Shiri Bibas taken hostages with her two children?

the way they had the propaganda queued up the next day was rly something to behold.

I remember being astonished at the immediate "response" by pro Hamas groups with printed signs at the ready.
How did they organize so swiftly? It was heartbreaking for me. There must have been a concerted propaganda machine
in place well before hand.

... and then there's the deniers... in spite of Hamas' generated documentation of the atrocities.

quatar has given tons of money to the very colleges where the protests sprang up.
the whole thing was a set up aimed at defeating joe biden.

It worked.

and so many rubes fell for it. The "pro-Palestine" protests were not pro-Palestine, they were designed to generate hatred of Jews and depress the Democratic vote here.

we’re a nation of useful idiots.

and the denial of reality continues on this very thread.

i learned sooo much about the persistent libels of the jews. but they seem to b a deep, dark secret to most ppl, cuz they’re popping up and being swallowed by folks who rly ought to know better. even here.

Mention anti-Semitism? Discuss ever other form of bigotry! Highlight the atrocities of Hamas? ISRAEL! Denialism and revisionism at its worst.

I don't think most reasonable people dispute that. I certainly don't. However, does this have something to do with the recent NYTimes article about Israel abusing their prisoners? The Japanese in WW2 were notorious abusers of prisoners - there is no argument. We abused prisoners in Abu Ghraib - there is no argument. It is never excusable under any circumstances whether committed by non-state actors or nation states. If recent reports are credible, heads need to roll. Here are two statements: People who act violently toward Jews as if Jewish individuals are a proxy for Israel is classic antisemitism, and "Remember Oct 7" is not the win some seem to think it is. Both are true at the same time.

but we have deniers here on DU. Their reasoning is that there is no proof, only the word of the alleged victims.

I stand by what I have said previously- All perpetrators of sexual violence should be brought to justice.

Netanyahu's Israel and IDF commit atrocities too.

Israel and the IDF are more single-minded, organized, competent, well-funded, well-armed, and have greater reach and quality in their propaganda.

All perps of sexual violence should be brought to justice.

It is the height of human depravity to sexualize war.

I also see when condemnations are made of Hamas it usually includes, not all Palestinians.
However when there are stories of antisemitism, the conversation (if there even is one) defects to Israel. I can count on one hand the condemnations of Israel that say, not all Jews. The idea of collective guilt is so deeply entrenched I think to many it is an accepted matter of fact.

Diaspora Jews from outside Israel bear the brunt of the antisemitism and, as such, serve as human shields in the post-Gaza conflict.

Collective guilt works both ways.

and arguably give tacit acceptance of the Oct 7 atrocities.

We see new antisemitic attacks posted every day at DU. Bigots acting to victimize any Jew including Jews that do not condone the actions taken by Israel and the IDF. They exist, some at DU.

how the reports of rapes and torture were just "exagerations".

What was also nauseating was how some bent over backwards trying to justify October 7.

As for the accusations regarding Israeli abuses of prisoners with dogs, if true it is deplorable. However, I will wait for what independent investigations uncover.

the release date was known in advance. the nyt opinion was designed to ‘both sides’ this report.
the piece is NOT credible. the sources r hamas members, some of whom made previous statements that r much tamer than those quoted in the piece. 1 of the sources was charged w sa in the past.

i dont think israel is perfect, but every crime they commit is front page news, and blown out of proportion.

I will try and stay on top of this for more information. If however there are Israeli whistleblowers
to corroborate, that's a different story.

esp since this was an opinion piece, not subject to even their lax standards.
they’ve had to walk back quite a few libels since oct 7, and that’s in their news division. there’s no reason to trust them.

that his justifies torturing, raping, burning, kidnapping women and babies?
Just what did Hamas accomplish on October 7th?

Black and white thinking is not becoming of anyone.

Answer that re those little girls in Iran.
The lack of condemnation is frightrning.

in all those instances from many different sources. You haven't?

plain and simple. qatar is the home of hamas. not palestine. qatar.

he didn't want to hear about what happened in Palestine before October 7, 2023, as if it's possible in the absence of context to honestly discuss what's happening there.

Chosen history doesn’t work for me or most of my relatives with Jewish blood.
Ethnic cleansing is ethnic cleansing and so are war crimes.

Context is only for the Gaza genocide and the crimes of Israel. The entitlement and lack of awareness of the double standards is highly disturbing.

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I'm coming to the conclusion that calling it antisemitism is too bland.

i’ve been calling it jew hate. more to the point.

Anti-Zionism and anti-semitism.

Were any of them asked their opinions about Israel? Chances are some were anti Zionists but no one asked them.

They were Jews and therefore were a target to be harassed.

Also at that time Israel was breaking records for killing Palestinian children that included American citizens.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/

Hamas has explicitly said, "Everything we do is justified"

than any other journalists in any other conflict in history, as well. More than 200 have been systematically targeted and killed, many by drone strikes, air strikes, and shelling.

Edit: and since October 7, 2023, thanks to the IDF, Gaza now has the largest number of child amputees per capita than anywhere else in the world.

masquerading as journos.

There’s at least one massive problem with their claims, though:

Is that justification for the torture, rape, burning alive of innocent people including young children -- and cheering about it?

I also condemn any Israelis celebrating the harm and death of innocent Palestinians
Celebrating another's pain -especially of innocents- is just downright evil.

and deflections instead of directly answering this question are answers in and of themselves.

I agree

Mandatory IDF military service for most Israeli citizens age 18 after growing up in a militarized apartheid state.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Cr-1t80qb5k

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/P7mJXO1GkgE

Here is a boatload from a YouTube search.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=idf+angels

It is well documented that both sides have committed at least some atrocities during and since October 7. There is no justification for these acts.

Efforts should be made to bring the perpetrators to justice regardless of what side they're on.

are denying that genocide and ethnic cleansing are ongoing in Gaza. They'll never honestly condemn the IDF. Count on that.

And because they are so stuck in justifying their actions based on the other actions of the other side, they stay in this stupid cycle of violence.

the actions of Hamas on October 7 AND the ethnic cleansing of Palestine by Israel.

For me, the shock was learning that Israelis, such as settlers and IDF soldiers, can be as bad.