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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWhat Is the U.S. Navy Telling Trump?
Trump isn't sending ships to the Strait of Hormuz. Why is that, do you suppose?
Well, I don't have any actual names or times, but here's probably the reason:
Naval expert have told Trump that there is no viable way that US Navy ships can safeguard shipping vessels through that bottleneck. Worse, it would be very difficult to even defend the Naval vessels themselves. Since we have no control over the land bases at the Strait, Iran could easily attack any warships we send in there, and with almost zero warning.
Bottom line: "Don't try it, Mr. President! It will fail miserably."
So, Trump calls for other nations to do it. But they aren't about to do something so stupid. Not a freaking chance.
Trump is stuck and has no valid way to get unstuck from this situation. "Stupid is as stupid does," once again.
ms liberty
(11,319 posts)Everyone else could see from miles away just exactly how disastrous this would be. Only a malignant narcissist with dementia and a staff of evil nazis would fall for this.
MadameButterfly
(4,124 posts)Hitler thought he was a military genius, didn't listen to advice, got upset if anyone criticized him. He made major decisions by intuition and feeling because no one could be superior to him in strategy.
There was no end to his ambition. Conveniently, loss of life didn't bother him.
EYESORE 9001
(29,861 posts)but his guts had shit-for-brains.
returnee
(961 posts)Nice turn of a phrase!
EYESORE 9001
(29,861 posts)In High Fidelity, John Cusacks character utters that phrase in one of many soliloquies.
modrepub
(4,158 posts)That other guy actually participated in a shooting war and at least initially scored major successes on the battlefield. Our current administration has been racking up loses almost from day 1. And while Venezia cant be categorized as an abject failure it certainly didnt pose a formidable opponent compared to what that mid 20th century despot faced early on.
thought crime
(1,745 posts)He seems to be lusting for conquest. This might not end well.
Jack Valentino
(5,193 posts)(back somewhere in the distant past he allegedly used to read...)
I've read it also---- but as a 'cautionary tale', and not as a 'playbook' !!
usonian
(26,234 posts)Is this his Ethiopia?
Is this his Austria? Poland?
I can't wait out the bunker scene.
That fascist playbook gets replayed time and time again.
Demonize some minority and ride that as far and as hard as you can.
We have to stop these or at the very least, limit the damage.
TRUMP'S BUNKER SCENE.

Callie1979
(1,386 posts)usonian
(26,234 posts)MadameButterfly
(4,124 posts)I never knew any of this. But it's logical: these men want complete control, want to always have their way, don't want to have to sacrifice. Instead of the discipline of healthy practices, they go for short term instant results and pleasure that have long term repercussions.
I don't know Trump's drug habits, only the presence of drugs in the White House during Trump 1, Trump's eating habits, Elon's ketamine dependence...these may be our greatest danger as well a our savior.
some_of_us_are_sane
(3,454 posts)thought crime
(1,745 posts)He wants to "clean up the neighborhood". Also, he's completely nuts.
Wounded Bear
(64,508 posts)with our other obligations around the world. I know trump doesn't really care about all that but still, resources are finite.
Wounded Bear
(64,508 posts)with our other obligations around the world. I know trump doesn't really care about all that but still, resources are finite.
efhmc
(16,890 posts)Maybe two of them are working at any given time.
BlueMTexpat
(15,699 posts)being generous!
MadameButterfly
(4,124 posts)and people in the military are concerned with how fast Trump is going through supplies.
Trump has never understood budgeting of any kind. The concept that resources are finite doesn't compute. He keeps saying that our supplies of munitions is unlimited.
I've never been for stockpiling military weapons but he could in the end, before he learns this lesson, leave us rather exposed. Not to mention Ukraine.
Meanwhile Ukraine is providing anti-drone technology to the US to protect US bases in the region. I wish I believed Ukraine would get something in return.
popsdenver
(2,503 posts)all oil sanctions on Russia...........Ukraine should be instead, using those drones on Russian Pipelines, Refineries, and oil tankers....
MadameButterfly
(4,124 posts)which I find amazing--how they have created an industry like that under their conditions. Ukraine's supply has to be limited and donating to us while we are committing war crimes seems a gamble. i heard that their drones are much cheaper than the weapons we were using to protect the bases. I don't want our bases destroyed--at least the soldiers in them--but the worse it is for Trump the sooner we get rid of him.
A normal president would appreciate tUkraine's help and notice that they are acting like an ally while Russia isn't. But that won't happen with Trump.
Blue_Roses
(13,904 posts)told Ukraine that he didn't want the help. Has that changed? These days things change so fast, I can't keep up.
MadameButterfly
(4,124 posts)I expect you are more updated on this than me. Probably he doesn't want their help because it would look pretty bad for him to need help from Ukraine, also to then turn on them. My understanding is that Ukraine can supply drones for a fraction of the cost, and this means Trump is saying no, he'd rather spend taxpayer dollars.
Blue_Roses
(13,904 posts)His ego doesn't allow him to ask for help.
MadameButterfly
(4,124 posts)Trump doesn't want their help but the countries being attacked do, and Ukraine and GB are forming a partnership.
Instead of being a helpless recipient of our charity, Ukraine is offering to help solve the problem Trump created.
I'm amazed at their genius and resilience. No wonder Trump hates it.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2026/3/18/over-200-ukrainian-military-experts-in-gulf-region-to-counter-irans-drones
efhmc
(16,890 posts)MineralMan
(151,478 posts)Last edited Mon Mar 16, 2026, 05:28 PM - Edit history (1)
Trump made an oath after finishing the military school he was sent to by his father: "If I get out of here, I swear I will never read another book in my lifetime!"
He kept that oath, even though he has failed to keep others.
efhmc
(16,890 posts)MadameButterfly
(4,124 posts)Hard to tell these days.
MineralMan
(151,478 posts)So...
MadameButterfly
(4,124 posts)i get your point, but without saying so some might think it's an actual quote.
MineralMan
(151,478 posts)thought crime
(1,745 posts)GopherGal
(2,938 posts)All such non-toady humans have long since disappeared from the Maladministration. I suspect some sort of narcissism weapon has been secretly deployed which repels any non-toadies and has to be turned off for certain diplomatic visits so that someone like Zelenskyy can get within 100 feet of him.
efhmc
(16,890 posts)MadameButterfly
(4,124 posts)So anyone not already in that state is in danger. I mean, people who choose to work there. I think Zelensky would manage to escape.
leftstreet
(41,171 posts)That would be newsworthy
MineralMan
(151,478 posts)They know how to evade Trump's orders. They are that much smarter than he is that he doesn't even notice.
leftstreet
(41,171 posts)German defense minister Pistorius this morning:
"What does Trump expect a handful of European frigates to do that the powerful US navy cannot?"
MineralMan
(151,478 posts)Rebl2
(17,892 posts)broke it and only they can fix it. So I am guessing this is going to drag on a while.
underpants
(196,976 posts)When hes not in the room? Jesus Ming Christ WE ing TOLD him and that stupid frat boy about this but NOOOOOO what do we know? Theyll just give up they said.
Swede
(39,889 posts)With lots of mentions of TRUMP.
Nittersing
(8,457 posts)I suspect it is very close to the truth.
funny/not funny
calimary
(90,508 posts)A chimp with a small dick who wants to compensate with a lot of big scary-looking guns.
With apologies to real chimpanzees wherever they may be.
spanone
(141,969 posts)Which Repuke congressperson would vote to Impeach?
thought crime
(1,745 posts)They're going to have a big backlog of impeachable offenses. They may need to do weekly impeachments.
Roc2020
(1,792 posts)Last edited Mon Mar 16, 2026, 01:09 PM - Edit history (1)
scenarios to escape are horrific. Walk away-Israel is left alone to fight. Put soldiers on Iran's soil, Iran waiting for that for decades to kill american troops, Nuke Iran, Israel gets nuked. Trapped.
MineralMan
(151,478 posts)Other nations aren't so stupid, though.
Roc2020
(1,792 posts)calimary
(90,508 posts)thought crime
(1,745 posts)i.e. I have no idea whatsoever.
But if Trump is as nuts as he sounds and he figures out that nuking Iran will get him in the history books and have no consequences for him personally, he might do it.
Happy Hoosier
(9,583 posts)Detecting and countering small naval drones is in its infancy. Most of our defences are oriented towards airborne threats.
As Ukraine has proven, it's virtually certain that a determined naval drone user will sneak one through now and again.
MiHale
(13,121 posts)Then theyll forget about Iran, high prices, terrorist attacks, oh yeah almost forgot EPSTEIN, EPSTEIN, EPSTEIN.
A sarcastic bent
GusBob
(8,275 posts)Is the Navy requesting that?
Are they trying to flood the zone with decoys and targets?
Is he trying to draw other countries into the conflict by getting one of their ships destroyed and sailors killed?
Does he think he can build a coalition?
Coming soon: he will claim anti-semitism because they wont help Israel
MineralMan
(151,478 posts)Cleverly, all of the European countries are saying "NO WAY!"
And he can't order anyone to join him in his stupidity.
republianmushroom
(22,542 posts)thought crime
(1,745 posts)Trump has insulted many of our allies and waged disruptive Trade Wars against them. He started an illegal war without consulting allies other than his business partner Netanyahu (more correct to say, Netanyahu informed Trump the war would start). Now he's begging them to sail their warships right into Iran's missile kill box.
But yes, I'm sure they are finding clever and creative ways to say No.
Raven123
(7,867 posts)We didnt scale up, so we have drawn down our resources.
Trump would love for someone else to try to clean up this mess so he can withdraw our military and blame that someone else for failure as this disintegrates.
Its Covid all over again (remember the speech in which he said it would be all over by Easter). Completely miscalculated.
BattleRow
(2,637 posts)lostnfound
(17,590 posts)1) nukes
2) complete and sudden withdrawal of US from Mideast
Sane presidents would do neither. But he remains stuck in his terrible two, with the worlds most fearsome arsenal at his disposal.
MineralMan
(151,478 posts)You forgot that one.
thought crime
(1,745 posts)Suddenly, the Trump Reality show has a serious side. What will Trump decide? We'll find out in a later episode, but first let's switch over to Cuba, where Trump is starving residents and preparing for conquest. Will Apprentice Marco Rubio become president of Cuba, or will Cuba become our 51st state? We'll find out in a later episode but now, let's switch back to Iran...
gab13by13
(32,601 posts)2 of them are in Asia right now.
Red Mountain
(2,374 posts)dang it.
AND we retired another 4 minesweepers based in the gulf in January......what terrible luck.
Probably just as well. There seem to be some questions about how effective the new minesweepers are at their jobs.
Scubamatt
(314 posts)when confronted with failure . . . Declare Victory, and command his media to replicate that message far and wide, announcing that in all the history of victories, there had never been a more victorious victory. The people will lap it up, and he will move on to the next distraction/disaster.
ffr
(23,442 posts)thought crime
(1,745 posts)LymphocyteLover
(10,027 posts)dalton99a
(94,995 posts)The answer was straightforward: Even one Iranian soldier or militia member zipping across the narrow neck of the strait in a speedboat could fire a mobile missile right into a slow-moving supertanker, or plant a limpet mine on its hull.
With oil already hovering around $100 a barrel, and insurance premiums for transiting the Persian Gulf surging, the image of more burning tankers would make the Iranians look more powerful than they really are. Already, having seen Iran attack shipping around the strait, tanker owners are refusing to take the risk, even after Mr. Trump declared on Fox last Sunday that they should show some guts.
The strait was Exhibit A in Irans ability to seize an asymmetric advantage. Despite ramped-up strikes in recent days against what little is left of the Iranian Navy, traffic through the strait has come to a near halt. A New York Times analysis concluded that as of Thursday, at least 16 oil tankers, cargo ships and other commercial vessels had been attacked in the Persian Gulf, including three in the narrowest part of the strait.
https://www.nytimes.com/2026/03/15/us/politics/trump-stark-choices-iran-war.html
BidenRocks
(3,441 posts)That's incredible!
jmowreader
(53,323 posts)They use magnets to stick to ships' hulls below the waterline. The Iranians are huge fans of them.
They have probably already been set to the hulls of the ships that are trapped there. Just waiting for the signal to activate them.
LilElf70
(1,614 posts)when you go into an unprovoked, illegal, no reason to attack, war. To make matters worse, there was absolutely no plan for after his initial hits.
Response to MineralMan (Original post)
gfarber Spam deleted by MIR Team
calimary
(90,508 posts)It just gets better and better!
Xolodno
(7,361 posts)I believe he's genuinely pissed from his first term when he was told "you can't do _insert whatever_" He is now doing what he wants and believes in his warped brain we are capable of doing anything. So who cares what they say, optics, strategy, logistics, etc. be damned.
thought crime
(1,745 posts)SusieCreamcheese
(48 posts)The Felon's foreign policy is based upon his own irritable bowel movements.
Justice matters.
(9,988 posts)Pesky gas prices suddenly get on his gut...
Escurumbele
(4,104 posts)They all knew this was going to be a disaster, why is the military obeying orders they know they should not?
This is so disappointing and scary at the same time, when the military gives in to a buffoon like trump you know things will get very, very bad for the entire country, that is how dictators get in power, the military becomes complicit, and in my opinion, that is what we are seeing today.
MineralMan
(151,478 posts)time refusing a Presidential order. Both literally and traditionally, they cannot do so. They can resign, but they cannot refuse.
It is a conflict that has never been really tested. So far, I believe Trump is listening to their reasons, but how long that will last I do not know.
thought crime
(1,745 posts)They were very careful to fire top officers and replace them with loyalists before starting these adventures.
Cha
(320,117 posts)Nations.
Sounds reasonable .. TY
OC375
(1,090 posts)Navy wants a mission to aggressively bring the fight to the enemy, and deny him initiative. That's what they do. They are excellent at it and have the means to do it. A single carrier fleet unchained can change the dynamics of the area for a generation or more. It's truly horrific.
Doing nothing, no objective, or ROE's that involve wearing blinders and taking crap isn't what Navy excels at. I'd imagine they are pretty steamed at showing up to a gig, only to find no immediate plan other than "Hold my beer while I tell everyone you'll kick their asses."
Trump is a tease, which is almost as bad to many of them as putting them in harms way for personal gain.
H2O Man
(79,187 posts)I've seen someone saying the "plan" involved taking control of Kharg island, when the battle ship coming from South Korea arrives. No, it's not ..... exactly for the reasons you outline. More, an amphibious landing would have to start out from Saudi Arabia's eastern coast, which is far enough away that it creates as high a risk as if they actually landed.
More, while the destruction escalates, both sides have been careful not to seriously damage the oil plants. The Saudis don't want that. The president is looking for an off-ramp, and it is not possible to say how all of this horror plays out. I think he will bluff about sending in troops, but hopefully not do so. Yet he did not learn the first lesson from our generation's war in Vietnam: one can win every battle, and still lose the war. Other culture's actions are not limited by our concepts of space and time, though this president surely is.
My fear -- and I'm interested in your and other opinions -- is that as Israel takes more damage as a direct result of Netanyahu's madness, will he resort to a nuke?
MineralMan
(151,478 posts)Trump says much, but does little, really. He has, no doubt, been warned about the risks of some of those actions. So, he talks a good battle, but doesn't really want one. Not really. It's one thing to stand off from the coast and attack targets. It's quite another to commit to putting ground troops at risk and with it a risk of high casualty numbers.
I am counting on Trump to cave on this, declare victory, and pull out. He'll leave the rest to Israel.
thought crime
(1,745 posts)Using a nuke would raise his profile in the history books and give him street cred. Someone please explain the consequences in great detail.
H2O Man
(79,187 posts)The guy who suggested nuking hurricanes at sea has a profound lack of understanding the implications. More, he has a total lack of concern. I put nothing past him. While I think Netanyahu is more likely to resort to using a nuclear weapon, either or both might.
John Farmer
(405 posts)He has not been seen or heard from in five days and the photo/video of him that have been shown are obviously AI-generated.
H2O Man
(79,187 posts)on this. Apparently his brother was killed, though it is unconfirmed if he was. This is just my opinion, but if it's only the brother, it increases the risk of Netanyahu resorting to a nuke. And if he is dead, it increases the chances of the synergy of extreme right-wing military leaders and religious fanatics doing so. A retired military intelligence officer on a podcast I watched said if it comes to that, Israel had & has plans that would involve dropping three. It's hard to imagine anyone thinking of doing such a thing.
BarbD
(1,477 posts)Last edited Mon Mar 16, 2026, 04:56 PM - Edit history (1)
Now we are stuck with the incompetent, stupid actions of idiots.
Reminds me of Tennyson's poem --"The Charge of the Light Brigade"...... Into the valley of Death rode the six hundred........."
gulliver
(14,053 posts)I'm a firm believer in not helping the enemy, even by brain fart speculation. I want us to win and get out. I'm perfectly willing to have Trump or anyone else running things saying whatever they think works: true, false, outrageous, juvenile, etc. Even if we thought the media were capable of anything resembling true transparency, we should still be against it. That should be obvious.
Most of the government folks and actual retired military expert commentators on CNN seem to be appropriately careful about how much they're willing to "explain" to the audience. But it's still pretty appalling when you see some (usually questionably informed) dummy opining that the IRGC, for example, seems to be "in charge." The lowlife Islamic Regime undoubtedly has access to CNN. Hopefully they get no comfort from it.
Emile
(42,954 posts)Iran has a submarine fleet consisting of approximately 28 to 30 vessels, including Kilo-class, Fateh-class, and Ghadir-class submarines.
MineralMan
(151,478 posts)Iran's military assets. I would not underestimate that intelligence, though.
EX500rider
(12,667 posts)Emile
(42,954 posts)Iran's submarines are primarily based at the Bandar Abbas naval base, located in the Strait of Hormuz. They operate in various waters, including the Persian Gulf, Gulf of Oman, Arabian Sea, and the Caspian Sea.
EX500rider
(12,667 posts)Emile
(42,954 posts)in the area.
EX500rider
(12,667 posts)They can hardly get deep enough not to be seen from the air for one.
And what depth to set depth charges for and anti-sub torpedos to search at becomes a lot easier.
Emile
(42,954 posts)Irans Midget Submarines are the Great Unknown for the U.S. Navy.
https://www.19fortyfive.com/2026/03/irans-midget-submarines-are-the-great-unknown-for-the-u-s-navy/
John Farmer
(405 posts)in little more than inner tubes could be a problem if they have the right rocket for the job.
Old Crank
(7,178 posts)Who said that Trump has no good way out of this message. The best might be declare a win and just leave tail between his legs. Other options are worse. And worse would be dragging this mess into the summer months before the elections.
I've seen where the heads of the British military and German military have both said essentially the same thing. Not our job or NATOs job to fix what you broke.
tintinvotes
(147 posts)Iran has agreed to let countries other than USA and Isreal thru the strait if they pay a toll, it's already happening. Brilliant plan by Iran to get paid.
C Moon
(13,702 posts)red dog 1
(33,351 posts)And shared on Bluesky.
Maninacan
(326 posts)When I was told to do something stupid at work I would sit on it. The orders were always reversed. Usually emergency setups in the shop and always the same person.
FakeNoose
(42,093 posts)... if he were ever stupid enough to attack them. This was all KNOWN in advance.

Buttoneer
(989 posts)thought crime
(1,745 posts)It they began escorting tankers there would be a Moskva type incident. They know this.
JBTaurus83
(1,593 posts)Increases by the day.
Historic NY
(40,112 posts)Aussie105
(8,115 posts)We will find out after his funeral.
Safe movement through that Straight is indefensible and impossible.
Donald isn't getting the message.
Other world leaders look at the situation and walk away.
DFW
(60,361 posts)Expletive Deleted
al bupp
(2,549 posts)So to speak.
Bluetus
(3,011 posts)As of now, Iranian tankers are passing through the Strait, as well as ships from any countries that are not aiding the US. But these countries can't use the lane: Saudi Arabia, Iraq, the UAE, Kuwait, Dubai, and Qatar.
Kaleva
(40,405 posts)The last of the Perry class were decommissioned years ago. The Butjrs and the few remaining Ticos are too valuable for such a role.